Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible**

[Mota]

Yeah this Hulk Hogan thing I can do without. They basically took a league full of wrestlers who are great at wrestling and turned them into a circus act. At one point they'll realize that Abyss is a terrible Hulkster, and Styles is a terrible Flair, and by that time Hogan and Bischoff will already have made their money and will be laughing all the way to the bank.

There have been so many fundamental character changes to the wrestlers over the past 2 years that the fans have no investment left in the characters. I mean, just a while ago AJ Styles was madly in love with Karen Angle and was basically a lackey to Kurt. Then he changes and we're supposed to take him seriously as a world title contender? Then after that, we're supposed to forget that he's a family man and a great guy and believe that he's the next Nature Boy?

Sorry, ain't gonna happen.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yeah this Hulk Hogan thing I can do without. They basically took a league full of wrestlers who are great at wrestling and turned them into a circus act. At one point they'll realize that Abyss is a terrible Hulkster, and Styles is a terrible Flair, and by that time Hogan and Bischoff will already have made their money and will be laughing all the way to the bank.

There have been so many fundamental character changes to the wrestlers over the past 2 years that the fans have no investment left in the characters. I mean, just a while ago AJ Styles was madly in love with Karen Angle and was basically a lackey to Kurt. Then he changes and we're supposed to take him seriously as a world title contender? Then after that, we're supposed to forget that he's a family man and a great guy and believe that he's the next Nature Boy?

Sorry, ain't gonna happen.

But hey, now we get to watch Nash & Young (where are Crosby & Stills) take on Hall & Waltman. Now THAT'S entertainment.

As much as I'd like to blame Hogan, Eric, Russo, et al, the bottom line is that the blame really lies with the 3rd-rate-star obsessed worthless sack of shit whose daddy bought her a company.

[BYU 14]

But hey, now we get to watch Nash & Young (where are Crosby & Stills) take on Hall & Waltman. Now THAT'S entertainment.

As much as I'd like to blame Hogan, Eric, Russo, et al, the bottom line is that the blame really lies with the 3rd-rate-star obsessed worthless sack of shit whose daddy bought her a company.


Good point, she is the one basically letting them run wild, no pun intended.

I think Bischoff does a good in the Heel boss role, but does anybody really want to see him in every 2nd or 3rd fucking segment? Also, it's about time it started to go somewhere vs him just being a random jerk to the Jarrett's and Foley's of the company.

[Maple Leafs]

Real good Bret Hart documentary available on youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAAJl45o5Fc

Lots of footage and stories from the early days, right through to Bret's decision to come back this year.

[Neon_Chaos]

< 30 Minutes to Wrestlemania!!!

I arrived back here in Manila two hours ago... an 18-hour ride across the Pacific and complete lack of sleep ain't gonna stop me from watching this one. :)

Very excited about the entire card.

[DeToxRox]

http://web6.twitpic.com/img/79993733-42bde4623af09846da6649f9fe679818.4bafdc4d-scaled.jpg

[Neon_Chaos]

That. Was. Awesome.

[Front Office Midget]

I thought it was a bit underwhelming. I remember being blown away by last year's match, and not as much this year...

[Schmidty]

That sucked balls. Glad I didn't pay for it.

I am seriously so tired of the UT.

[DeToxRox]

I thought it was a bit underwhelming. I remember being blown away by last year's match, and not as much this year...

That was amazing. Keep in mind Undertaker had his hip replaced since last year's WM.

[Schmidty]

That was amazing. Keep in mind Undertaker had his hip replaced since last year's WM.

I agree that the match was very good. I'm just sick of the result. There's almost no point anymore.

[Front Office Midget]

That was amazing. Keep in mind Undertaker had his hip replaced since last year's WM.

Ah, I don't really know what's been happening. I've watched like 3 Raws since last year's Wrestlemania.

With the lack of mindblowing spots, it became apparent that Undertaker was going to win, and that the match was more about Michaels' retirement.

Perhaps I overhyped this to myself... I remember thinking last year's match was the best I had seen in 10 years. This was just a great match, but not at the same level.

But damn, I can't believe Michaels' career is over. It's as if my childhood is dying!

[Noop]

Awesome main event.

[Schmidty]

But damn, I can't believe Michaels' career is over. It's as if my childhood is dying!

I highly doubt that his career is over. He'll be back after a few months.

[BYU 14]

That was amazing. Keep in mind Undertaker had his hip replaced since last year's WM.

I agree and while it wasn't at the level of last years it was still damn good, especially considering these guys are both well into their 40s. Michaels sells like nobody in the business, some of the younger guys could learn a lot from him.

Some sick bumps in that ladder match as well.

[Matthean]

Didn't watch it, and I'll have to talk to a coworker about it, but was poking around the internet and the matches up to Taker vs. HBK were vastly being viewed as being not worth the money and maybe the worst Wrestlemania.
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[JonInMiddleGA]

I highly doubt that his career is over. He'll be back after a few months.

There's definitely a school of thought that says we'll see him again (and I agree with that), but there also seems to be a good bit of "sources say" that he isn't likely to return for anything more than guest-hosting or a brief one-off feud. Physically he's said to be very worn down.

[Neon_Chaos]

It was a great show from top to bottom.

I think UT and HBK managed to top off their match last year.

edit: Easily the best WM for me since 20.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Impact ratings down to a 0.56, A18-34 down over 50% from the previous week (even I think that one is an anamoly). Raw did a 3.66, up 13% from the previous week, highest rating with M18-49 since January, second highest since last year's post-WM episode.

TNA Wrestling News - Major Update On WWE RAW vs. TNA iMPACT! Ratings (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/272063527.shtml)

[BYU 14]

Those ratings are painful. I think the one live, one taped approach is killing TNA and they need to rethink that.

Granted the RAW after Wrestlemania is typically spiked in terms of viewers, but TNA can not go on with rating that low.

Next weeks show has some goot matches lined up (A couple PPV quality) so it will be interesting to see how that does....

I still wish they would bring Heyman in though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I still wish they would bring Heyman in though.

Did you see last week where Bischoff claimed he asked Paul to come but he turned him down?

[BYU 14]

Did you see last week where Bischoff claimed he asked Paul to come but he turned him down?

I didn't, but if that was a shoot I would have to think he said no because Russo is still there.....and well, so is Bischoff.

[Terps]

Ugh... Not looking forward to Smackdown this week.

Edge beats up Jericho, Swagger comes out and hits Edge with the briefcase, cashes in his MITB and becomes the new World Heavyweight Champion.

[BYU 14]

Ugh... Not looking forward to Smackdown this week.

Edge beats up Jericho, Swagger comes out and hits Edge with the briefcase, cashes in his MITB and becomes the new World Heavyweight Champion.

Great way to bring WM momentum to a grinding halt...

[JonInMiddleGA]

I didn't, but if that was a shoot I would have to think he said no because Russo is still there.....and well, so is Bischoff.

Mea culpa here, it wasn't Bischoff who said it, it was Russo.
Part of an interview with Russo in The Sun promoting his book, he says
"On Paul Heyman: "Oh, and one last thing, for the record: I called Paul E personally to ask him to join TNA. He declined."

I guess I got my promotion killers mixed up ;)

[Mota]

Yeah it seems like the WWE just doesn't know how to promote young talent. They ignore them and job them out constantly, and then all of a sudden super push them and expect the crowd to embrace the wrestlers. It just doesn't work.

The weirdest thing is that TNA applies that same theory to ALL of their wrestlers, pushing, depushing, turning them constantly and wondering why the fans don't feel any emotional connection to ANYBODY.

[molson]

Chris Kanyon is dead - apparently a suicide.

He had a very strange career. He was lower-midcard kind of guy who had a couple of brushes with major superstardum, first with DDP in WCW, and then during the invasion in the WWF.

[Maple Leafs]

Chris Kanyon is dead - apparently a suicide.

He had a very strange career. He was lower-midcard kind of guy who had a couple of brushes with major superstardum, first with DDP in WCW, and then during the invasion in the WWF.
Didn't he come out as gay, and at one point try to promote himself as the world's first openly gay athlete?

[molson]

Didn't he come out as gay, and at one point try to promote himself as the world's first openly gay athlete?

Ya, he tried to make that his gimmick, but then later claimed it was all just a gimmick and he was straight.

[BYU 14]

Ya, he tried to make that his gimmick, but then later claimed it was all just a gimmick and he was straight.


I thought it was legit as he gave several (in appeared) serious interviews on the subject and felt that it got him blackballed. He was a pretty talented performer, that just never got completely over.

Nevertheless, sad that yet another Pro Wrestler is dead before reaching 50.

[Toddzilla]

Well, I guess Christopher Daniels finally had enough of the TNA bullshit...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well, I guess Christopher Daniels finally had enough of the TNA bullshit...

I hope that's the case at least.

For those that missed it, here's a recap of last night's ROH PPV (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/272357690.shtml)

[DeToxRox]

I had burned out on ROH a bit but the HDNet show the last few months is just excellent. Cornette's finger prints are all over ROH now and it's for the best that is for sure. KoW vs the Briscoes will easily end up the Tag Team MOTY. Just awesome stuff.

Funny to think that the Briscoes will most likely be in WWE by years end.

[DeToxRox]

Bryan Alvarez is apparently confirming Daniels is gone from TNA.

[Toddzilla]

Funny to think that the Briscoes will most likely be in WWE by years end.With all of the Confederate signage, there is NO WAY the WWE brings on the Briscoes. Unless they wrestle in full body suits ala the Gladiators perhaps...

[JonInMiddleGA]

With all of the Confederate signage, there is NO WAY the WWE brings on the Briscoes.

Well there's obviously some interest on the WWE's part since they've already worked a dark match before an SD taping back in November & that led to a week long tryout in Florida afterwards.

There's a pretty strong consensus that all anyone is waiting on is a) their drug screening to come back clean & b) their ROH contracts to expire or a buyout to be negotiated.

[DeToxRox]

Well there's obviously some interest on the WWE's part since they've already worked a dark match before an SD taping back in November & that led to a week long tryout in Florida afterwards.

There's a pretty strong consensus that all anyone is waiting on is a) their drug screening to come back clean & b) their ROH contracts to expire or a buyout to be negotiated.

Yep. Though I will say this, if Nigel McGuiness failed WWE's entrance physical, I have no idea how Mark Briscoe will pass it. That guy is held together by duct tape.

[Toddzilla]

But since the WWE doesn't really do real "tag-teams", rather they throw together 2 guys and hope it sticks, why waste the money to just bury them on Superstars?

[DeToxRox]

TNA tonight is continuing to set a new standard of terrible.

[DeToxRox]

WWE is moving Smackdown to SyFy come October:

WWE's 'Smackdown' moving to Syfy
April 12, 2010 | 6:00 pm

Syfy Channel has pinned a deal for "Smackdown."
World Wrestling Entertainment Inc's "Smackdown," which for years was a mainstay on the UPN and CW networks before moving to News Corp.'s My Network TV, is now headed to NBC Universal's Syfy Channel, people close to the situation said.

A deal, which will be announced later this week, further solidifies the growing relationship between NBC Universal and Vince McMahon's WWE. Syfy already carries the show "NXT," which is a reality program featuring wannabe wrestlers trying to make it to the big leagues of WWE. NBC Universal's USA cable channel also carries WWE programming including "WWE Raw."

Although terms were not disclosed, My Network TV was shelling out roughly $20 million a year for "Smackdown." Syfy's price tag is believed to be closer to $30 million a year.

Although "Smackdown" is more than 10 years old, it still does very well with men, particularly the 18-34 demographic, and generally averages about 3.5 million viewers overall. "Smackdown" will continue to air on Friday nights when it moves to Syfy later this year, most likely in either late September or early October.

WWE is still looking to launch its own cable network, probably sometime in 2011. This latest deal with NBC Universal is another sign that the two could end up partnering on such a channel. WWE chief Vince McMahon has close relationships with NBC Universal brass, particularly Dick Ebersol, who oversees all sports programming for the company. Just a few weeks ago, Ebersol took part in an induction ceremony for broadcaster Bob Uecker into the WWE's hall of fame, which was also broadcast as a special on the USA Network.

-- Joe Flint

[Terps]

Ugh, I'm going to RAW next week, and the guest host(s) are the cast of 'MacGruber'.

I was hoping the episode I was going to would be the draft.

[BYU 14]

Hardy was apparently legit burned in the match with Roode. Hogan said last night they had to redo the segment three times when they taped it and when it finally worked Hardy's head caught on fire for a second, since he was already covered with the substance (Hogan said Kerosene) from the two failed attempts. You could definitely see the edit when he finally took the flame.

TNA is really blowing a good opportunity with the talent they have, I hope they pick it up.

[molson]

There's something poetic, or fitting, about TNA setting it's talent's heads on fire.

[DeToxRox]

The flight restrictions out of Great Britain have been extended to 7 PM locally, making it even harder for the Raw crew to get back to the United States for Monday's taping in New Jersey.

From PWI.

The SD crew got home today so it's looking more and more like Raw will be SD on Monday.

[General Mike]

Meltzer posted on his site that they're gonna try to tape interviews in a studio for the guys who are wrestling at Extreme Rules if they can't get back.

[Terps]

Well, fuck.

I'm going to avoid news of this until Monday morning, and hope some of the RAW guys are there at least. I rarely watch Smackdown, so I definitely wouldn't have paid to go see it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Waltman no-shows the TNA PPV tonight, Bischoff is reportedly not there either (that part seems like an angle since Hogan references it in a promo), and Doug Williams is stripped of the X-Division title since he's stuck in the UK because of the Iceland volcano and can't make it there to defend.

[RainMaker]

Did you guys know that Kozlov is in The Wire?

[molson]

Speaking of Kozlov, he was in a bit tonight where Will Forte (as "MacGruber") "rigged the arena with explosives" for some reason, which resulted in R-Truth, I don't know, blowing up or something. Only his shoes were left behind. This resulted in MacGruber having to wrestle Kozlov....for some reason.

That was awful. I'm pretty forgiving of the WWE, but for god's sake....

[SirFozzie]

TNA had a pretty damn good card with a new champion too.

[Terps]

I was at RAW (Smackdown) tonight, and it was a pretty good show overall. Also, because of the RAW stars not being there, the WWE is issuing a refund.

The two matches taped for Superstars were Yoshi Tatsu vs. Zack Ryder, and John Morrison vs. Carlito.

Triple H cut an off air promo, calling out the Undertaker, Undertaker came out for a match against him after it went off the air. All the wrestlers that were on the show tonight rushed the ring and were either greeted to a pedigree, chokeslam or tombstone. Undertaker tombstoned Trips after all of that went down to close out the night.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Relatively good news after scary stuff for a couple of underappreciated female wrestlers. Daffney says she's okay, just a stinger & a concussion after a blown spot while working with a trainee at a dark match last week. Here's a link to her blog entry (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/273976453.shtml) where she talks about what happened including what was going through her head when she realized she wasn't able to move her legs.

On a personal note, I had an odd opportunity a few years ago to spend a couple of hours hanging out around Daffney, aka Shannon Spruill, before a client's annual sales meeting. Her ring persona aside, she was a quiet little thing with a sweet personality & not an ounce of pretension. And while checking the 'net for the spelling of her last name I discovered that I either didn't know or didn't remember that she was once married to guitarist Rich Ward (Stuck Mojo/Fozzy).

Meanwhile, indy hardcore icon LuFisto is recovering from an apparent stroke. The scary details are linked here.
411mania.com: Wrestling - LuFisto Updates Fans on Her Stroke (http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/news/136564/LuFisto-Updates-Fans-on-Her-Stroke.htm)

Ain't no female wrestler I respect or enjoy watching more than this one, tougher than nails with a great quirky character, with the added benefit of being hotter than a two dollar pistol.

[DeToxRox]

Blood letting in WWE. Shelton Benjamin and Mickie James are the big names gone, but Funaki, Slam Master J, Jimmy Yang and Katie Burchill are also gone.

[bulletsponge]

they cut mickie :(

[Mota]

Shelton will find work quickly. He's really good. Sorry for Mickie but after the whole "Piggy James" angle how are you supposed to recover? The only way to get her heat back would be to destroy McCool which never happened. At least not that I remember since I fast forward all the WWE Divas matches, they suck so badly.

[DeToxRox]

Apparently Mickie has been partying too hard in Europe and she wants to do music so it isn't a big deal.

On an PWI interview a month or so ago a guy said someone in WWE was contemplating MMA which I think is the next logical move for Shelton.

[DeToxRox]

The word making the rounds in Baltimore, where the WWE crew has already arrived for tomorrow's Extreme Rules PPV, is that Batista is finishing up with the company this week. He's challenging John Cena in a Last Man Standing bout on the PPV. Batista has made noises about leaving dating back to this January, so we'll see whether this is really it or not for him soon enough.

[saldana]

The word making the rounds in Baltimore, where the WWE crew has already arrived for tomorrow's Extreme Rules PPV, is that Batista is finishing up with the company this week. He's challenging John Cena in a Last Man Standing bout on the PPV. Batista has made noises about leaving dating back to this January, so we'll see whether this is really it or not for him soon enough.


bubba the love sponge had kurt angle on friday afternoon and they were talking about this quite a bit...apparently batista, jericho, and mysterio are all expiring with WWE very soon and have all made some sort of contact with TNA about jumping over.

[ageofquarrel]

Just went to Chikara's night two of Chikara's King of Trios tournament it was an amazing show. 2 teams from Japan (BJW and Osaka Pro) easily stole the show.

[DeToxRox]

Jericho won't leave WWE for TNA. He detests Bischoff. I could see Rey possibly leaving but doubtful. Batista wants to be an actor. Could leave but I think movies are his goal.

[molson]

What does TNA pay compared to the WWE? I can't imagine how they have so much money to pay all these people. I guess rarely having to travel makes some amount of a pay cut worth it, but the WWE is just in a different stratosphere when it comes to revenue. I'm sure they don't share that with the talent as much as they needed to in the Monday Night Wars days, but, i'd still think they could easily out-bid TNA for top talent.

[JonInMiddleGA]

What does TNA pay compared to the WWE? I can't imagine how they have so much money to pay all these people. I guess rarely having to travel makes some amount of a pay cut worth it, but the WWE is just in a different stratosphere when it comes to revenue. I'm sure they don't share that with the talent as much as they needed to in the Monday Night Wars days, but, i'd still think they could easily out-bid TNA for top talent.

Oh they can easily outbid TNA for anyone they want, but that's the key: that they want. Realistically Vince hasn't shed any significant tears over the defection of pretty much anyone that's gone to the other side of the street.

Plus TNA is paying truly crap wages to the majority of the roster, $500 per appearance (i.e. most of the roster doesn't get paid if they aren't used) for the middle range, even less for most of the Knockouts as well as the guys on the bottom. Sting-types not withstanding, TNA pay has been topping out below $150k per year while the WWE has quite a few in the 7-figure annual pay. The only way TNA has been able to afford the bigger names (Sting & Hogan most notably) is that Spike is contributing directly to their salaries, something that started with Sting & has continued.

[JonInMiddleGA]

gave freedom to take indie dates if needed.

But even that is now contractually controlled by TNA, very strictly so, often pricing them out of the range of the indies that would use them because of the amount TNA adds to the price so that they can get their cut as a "booking fee". That's one of the reasons that some of the guys who've asked for their release have done so, because they can make more with control of their own bookings (although several have subsequently made a deal with Bill Behrens to help with their arrangements, albeit for a much smaller fee).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yippee, it's a midcarder battle royal ;)

[Terps]

Well, now that Jericho and Edge are on RAW I have no reason to pay attention to Smackdown, since my 4 favorites are all on RAW (Orton, Edge, Y2J, Miz.)

Also, maybe Miz will actually defend his US title now since ShoMiz is no longer.

[DeToxRox]

I think it is fairly obvious that WWE even more then ever sees SD as a dead brand until October comes and they move to SyFy. I suspect around then they will do some type of trade or draft or whatever and that is when SD will get some bigger names back.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I know everyone says TNA knew this week was going to be bad & all but ... damn.

TNA Wrestling News - They're In - Early WWE RAW vs. TNA iMPACT! Ratings (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/274414529.shtml)
TNA iMPACT! drew a 0.5 cable rating on Monday. More shortly.
WWE RAW drew a 3.1 cable rating on Monday. More shortly.

[RainMaker]

I never liked the seperate brands. Just seemed odd to have different two world champions and so on. It would make some sense if there was an actual rivalry between the two but any attempts at that seem poor.

I thought it would be better if they made Raw the main brand and used it for the big storylines and World Championship. Then use Smackdown to build up younger stars and actually build a storyline or two for the tag division and lower belts.

[Mota]

I know everyone says TNA knew this week was going to be bad & all but ... damn.

TNA Wrestling News - They're In - Early WWE RAW vs. TNA iMPACT! Ratings (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/274414529.shtml)
TNA iMPACT! drew a 0.5 cable rating on Monday. More shortly.
WWE RAW drew a 3.1 cable rating on Monday. More shortly.

The funny thing is that the Monday Night Wars are not happening like in the late 90's. TNA came in and they're both basically draining each other's markets. They're not pulling in any new fans at all. 3.1 is a pretty weak rating for the draft special, and 0.5 is basically pathetic. Poor TNA has so many great wrestlers but they've abused them for so long that their value is minimal.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Is NXT always this bad?

[Terps]

I think it is fairly obvious that WWE even more then ever sees SD as a dead brand until October comes and they move to SyFy. I suspect around then they will do some type of trade or draft or whatever and that is when SD will get some bigger names back.

It's actually good for guys like Christian, MVP, Ziggler, maybe even Kane becomes prominent again, since there's less top talent on Friday nights.

[Maple Leafs]

I never liked the seperate brands. Just seemed odd to have different two world champions and so on. It would make some sense if there was an actual rivalry between the two but any attempts at that seem poor.
What are you talking about? They've totally distinguished the brands. Have you ever seen a show where both brands are on at the same time? They're wearing different shirts! Like, not just a few. Every single guy!

DIFFERENT SHIRTS!

[RainMaker]

Is NXT always this bad?
It is really bad. They have some talent on the show but there is little in-ring action going on.

For all the credit Vince gets, people don't really point out how many massive failures he has on his resume.

[DeToxRox]

PWI is reporting that barring a last minute change, Jim Ross will officially depart WWE tomorrow. The rumor right now is Mark Cuban's HDNet wants him badly and JR wants to call MMA so he will be doing a lot of their MMA programming.

What a disaster this is. The best announcer of all time leaving without a send off. The way WWE has treated him is such a mockery.

[Terps]

He hasn't been on TV in forever. He was supposed to call WrestleMania this year and they changed their mind about that.

[PilotMan]

Is NXT always this bad?

No shit Jon. I could only watch a few minutes and it was terrible.

[RainMaker]

PWI is reporting that barring a last minute change, Jim Ross will officially depart WWE tomorrow. The rumor right now is Mark Cuban's HDNet wants him badly and JR wants to call MMA so he will be doing a lot of their MMA programming.

What a disaster this is. The best announcer of all time leaving without a send off. The way WWE has treated him is such a mockery.
I find the new announcers horrible. Cole is like a robot who repeats the same catchphrases and Striker is beyond abysmal.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Won't know for sure until later (as Dixie Carter has Twittered a "major announcement" coming on tonight's Impact) but reportedly TNA officials notified the locker room earlier today that they're moving the show back to Thursdays.

[RainMaker]

Does anyone know why they keep shitting on Daniel Bryan on NXT?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Does anyone know why they keep shitting on Daniel Bryan on NXT?

My guess was that he'll have some sort of epiphany (either going full heel or beating Miz down) & go on a miraculous tear that leads him to one of the bigger brands.

[RainMaker]

I was worried that this was Vince's way of saying that he doesn't give a shit what you've done in ROH or other promotions. And that you can be exciting in the ring all you want, but it means shit in the WWE.

[Mota]

My guess was that he'll have some sort of epiphany (either going full heel or beating Miz down) & go on a miraculous tear that leads him to one of the bigger brands.

And by then it may be too late as it's hard to care about someone that's 0-9. At least in the beginning he was losing to Jericho and Khali, now it's other rookies.

In reality it's probably Vince taking a dump on the internet fans.

[JonInMiddleGA]

TNA Returns To Thursdays May 13 (http://www.tnawrestling.com/news/item/1930-tna-returns-to-thursdays-may-13)

Back to Thursday at 9p starting May 13th, preceded by reACTION at 8pm starting June 24.

[Toddzilla]

That's quite the spin they put on the announcement, huh?

[DeToxRox]

TNA spoilers .. Just wow so far.

* Eric Bischoff out first. He says he really does love each and everyone of us. He introduces the TNA Heavyweight Champion, Rob Van Dam. TNA has a poll to see the top ten rankings to see who he'd face. Jeff Hardy is the next on the list after Desmond Wolfe, so nothing would be better than RVD vs. Hardy tonight. Only problem is no one can find Hardy so they'll give him the night off. RVD says he loves being champ and the best thing is defending the belt so no night off for because he's the whole F'N show. AJ Styles' music hits and he comes out and says watch your mouth, you're a champion for God's sake and a role model. He asks RVD if he wants to wrestle because AJ is in the mood to hurt someone. AJ asks if he thinks the people came to see RVD? No, they came to see AJ because he is TNA. He says even though he has RVD in 3 days, he still wants the match tonight because he will always be champ. Jeff Hardy's music hits and out he comes. He says he's been confused by the new days to show up and doesn't have a secretary but he's here tonight for his match. AJ protests and says it's his match. Hardy says RVD is the champ so how about he makes it a 3 way? Bischoff says that's a great idea and says the match is tonight.

* JB backstage with the Beautiful People talking about Tara. Madison Rayne says Tara needs to get over it that she's not the champ anymore and she is now. Velvet Sky says they're going to stay champs after the PPV because she said so. Lacey interrupts because she really has to pee and runs off. Madison asks why she's here and Velvet says it's because she's pretty, that's why.

* Taylor Wilde vs. Tara. Taylor went for a springing splash off the second turnbuckle and Tara kicked her in the gut and got the pin. Afterward Tara beat Taylor with her knee brace. Sarita ran out for the save. Afterwards they'd showed footage of Chelsea in the back crying while a major scene was going down with security and officials trying to find out what's going on. Desmond was trying to get some room for her as this was going on.

* Brian Kendrick vs ?. Before we find out we go back to Chelsea crying as police are coming to investigate. Brian Kendrick vs. Douglas Williams. He still has the X Division belt with him. Before the match, Douglas calls Kendrick a loser and hasn't seen him a single Match so he isn't worthy of a shot at the title so this is non title. Kazarian comes out to join the commentary table. During the match, Kaz comes to the ring to get the belt and it distracts Williams long enough for Kendrick to get the win via schoolboy.

* Christy Hemme in the back tries to get a word with Pat Kenney about a possible assailant. Kenney says he can't believe what he heard and leaves.

* Generation Me vs ?. They go to the back and Christy Hemme says if the assailant is true it will be major news. Police aren't allowing the name to be released. Generation Me vs Matt Morgan Morgan gives one the Hellevator and the other the Carbon Footprint. Morgan gets on the mic and says they warned Hogan there'd be carnage if he didn't tell him who their partner would be at Sacrifice. Morgan gets ready to stomp one of the Me's and Samoa Joe comes out for the save and Musclebusters Morgan and takes off.

* After Joe is gone and Morgan is out, the Band come out with the briefcase for the tag title shot. Nash and Hall cash it in. Nash just pins Morgan immediately. Winner and new TNA Tag Team Champions, the Band.

* Beer Money, Inc. vs. Motor City Machine Guns vs. Team 3D vs. Ink Inc. One of Shannon Moore's earrings was ripped out and he's bleeding profusely Winner via Spear from Neal on Brother Ray, Ink Inc. Team 3D gets in Jesse's face afterwards, mad that they're the ones who trained him and got him here and this the thanks they get.

* For the Global Championship, Rob Terry vs. Abyss. Abyss doesn't come out when his music plays. Orlando Jordan sneaks in from the crowd and low blows Terry and holds onto Terry's package for a prolonged time. Jordan gets a pipe and beats Terry with it. He shows Terry a playing card, probably the queen of hearts, and then throws the deck on Terry. Jordan gets on the mic and says it's about time to cut the foreplay. He does what he wants, says what he wants and acts how he wants because he's the TNA wildcard. He asks if the people want him to leave. They say yes. OJ says he'll let them fulfill their every fantasy. He challenges anyone in the back to make him leave. Tomko comes out and we get Orlando Jordan vs. Tomko. Winner via guillotine choke, Orlando Jordan.

* Backstage, Bischoff says Tara sure is going to wrestle again. Her attitude has been piss poor and what she did to Taylor was uncalled for. He tells her to get out to the ring right now.

* Sarita vs. Tara. Winner via knee brace shot to Sarita while the ref was blinded, Tara. Afterwards she attacked Sarita but the ref broke it up.+

* TNA Champion Rob Van Dam vs. Jeff Hardy vs. AJ Styles. Mr. Anderson came out during the match and attacked Hardy. At the same time, AJ pulled the referee in the way of an RVD top rope sidekick. AJ dove onto everybody on the outside. RVD got spiked with a DDT on the outside and AJ rolled him in for the win.

* Hardy gets on the mic with RVD afterwards. He tells RVD to leave because he's got this. He calls Anderson to the ring right now and let's do this. Anderson makes like he's going to the ring but goes to leave instead. Hogan's music hits and Hogan won't let him leave. Hardy attacks Anderson and they begin to brawl all over the place. Hardy swantons off the announce table onto a prone Mr. Anderson who was on a table below.

[DeToxRox]

Updated the spoilers.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Impact ought to be renamed Implosion.

[saldana]

that sounds like a decent show...im sure it sucked though

[RainMaker]

So they cut Daniel Bryan from NXT. I can't tell if they just wanted to shit all over one of the biggest indy names out there or if this is part of a bigger storyline. His exit interview was pretty awesome though either way.

WWE: Mediaplayer > WWE NXT: Daniel Bryan discusses his elimination (http://www.wwe.com/content/media/video/vms/wwenxt/2010/may8-14/14425312)

[molson]

The Daniel Bryan storyline is really odd. It's kind of refreshing in that way, actually.

Here was the most-hyped "rookie" from the get-go, we hear about his exploits in the independents, he's ranked #1 in the rookie poll despite never winning a match, and then still never wins a match before departing NXT. Then he goofs on the WWE "Daniel Bryan" character, kind of acting all bitter, and proclaiming that he's still a big deal on the independents.

Maybe he just goes away forever now, but I doubt it. I could see him pushed as an arrogant "internet darling" heel, or as a no-gimmick-needed face. I think he'll be one of those, I just get the sense that the company still likes him.

[Matthean]

People on the City of Heroes forum mention NXT is basically dead in the water, so he's likely to be switched over to one of the other shows. I can't imagine Vince being dumb enough to sign the best indy wrestler, making a mockery of him, and then letting him go in such a short period of time.
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[DeToxRox]

PWI reported that Danielson is actually headed to Raw as Bryan Danielson to team with someone (rumored to be Morrison) against Miz & Jericho. All I can say is yes please.

This was the plan all along but then with the ratings nose diving they are trying to hurry the finish up.

[molson]

I think Danielson is going to be big in the WWE, ala CM Punk. They have the charisma that plays well on TV, that most hyped indy guys don't have.

A lot of people said Punk would be buried because "Vince didn't create him" - and now he's a multiple-time World Champion. I think that whole theory is silly - Vince didn't even create Hulk Hogan.

[DeToxRox]

Pro Wrestling Superstar Virgil on Raw!

[Toddzilla]

Guess who....

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/uploads/2/SavageRandy_1.jpg

[JonInMiddleGA]

Guess who....

My first guess (before cheating) was Paul Ellering, so count me wrong.

[CU Tiger]

not sure how to cheat...but face looks like Oooooohhhh YEAH

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Epic Beard Man?

[JonInMiddleGA]

not sure how to cheat

Well if you ain't cheatin', you ain't tryin' ;)

I right-clicked the image, did View Image, the file name of the image gave away the mystery identity, which is the case at least as often as not on stuff like this

[duckman]

OHHHH YEEEAAAAHHH! DIGIT!

[Terps]

He just got married again recently.

http://www.thewrestlinganswer.com/images/galleries/rsavagemarried/1.jpg

[MikeVic]

He had to move on from Miss Elizabeth.

[molson]

The WWE finally cuts loose Carlito, after a wellness violation and his refusal to go to rehab.

And I just caught up with Tuesday's NXT. Bryan Danielson is definitely still around. He got to beat up Michael Cole. But I'm skeptical of the "I'm a big deal on the indys and the WWE sucks for not recognizing that" gimmick having any staying power.

[Terps]

I'm sure Primo will be next then. They have nothing for him if he isn't teaming/feuding with Carlito.

[DeToxRox]

Jon is probably unable to report this due to shock but:


TNA Tag Team champion Scott Hall was arrested on 5/14 and charged with disorderly conduct and resisting a police officer, according to The Orlando Sentinel.

Authorities were called to the Hitching Post Bar in Chuluota after Hall, who had been "drinking heavily" according to a police report, "became aggressive." The article noted that Hall allegedly pushed one customer, then argued with a female bartender. When he was told the bar was getting him a ride home, he shoved two females outside the bar and punched the window of the car.

When authorities arrived, they found Hall yelling and cursing at the patrons and staff of the bar. When he was told he was being taken into custody, he allegedly responded, "I ain't going down for this [expletive deleted],' This is [expletive deleted]. You know it's [expletive deleted]."

Hall was told he was not allowed to return to the establishment.

On his police report, Hall listed himself as an "unemployed" professional wrestler.

[DeToxRox]

Also, in pretty cool news, Rampage Jackson along with Bradley Cooper and another guy from A-Team will be hosting the next 3 hour Raw in a couple of weeks. Interesting that one of the biggest names in UFC will be allowed to promote on WWE but should be awesome.

[JonInMiddleGA]

So I read (http://network.yardbarker.com/WWE/article_external/WWE_NXT_Season_1_Finale/2677332) where Wade Barrett wins NXT but more interesting to me is the list for season two of the show.

Among the contenders are "Michael McGillicuty", the son of Curt Henning, "Husky Harris" the son of Mike Rotundo/grandson of Blackjack Mulligan (paired with Cody Rhodes as his pro), and "Laval" better known to most of us as Low-Ki.

Of course in the infinite WWE wisdom, Laval will be coached by ... Layla & Michelle McCool (and no, I'm not making that up).

[molson]

So I read (http://network.yardbarker.com/WWE/article_external/WWE_NXT_Season_1_Finale/2677332) where Wade Barrett wins NXT but more interesting to me is the list for season two of the show.

Among the contenders are "Michael McGillicuty", the son of Curt Henning, "Husky Harris" the son of Mike Rotundo/grandson of Blackjack Mulligan (paired with Cody Rhodes as his pro), and "Laval" better known to most of us as Low-Ki.

Of course in the infinite WWE wisdom, Laval will be coached by ... Layla & Michelle McCool (and no, I'm not making that up).

The strange thing is that the Rotundo/Hennig bloodlines were acknowledged on-air, but they still used the ridiculous FCW name-generator that gave us other gems like "Lucky Cannon"

[JonInMiddleGA]

the ridiculous FCW name-generator

LOL, great description.

[Matthean]

Jon is probably unable to report this due to shock but:

I refuse to understand why he keeps getting a contract considering we all know the ending.

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[JonInMiddleGA]

I refuse to understand why he keeps getting a contract considering we all know the ending.

"Stroke" ain't just the name of a Jeff Jarrett move ;) If you've got the right friends, there's almost always work to be had.

[Sun Tzu]

God dammit Hall. Seriously...this guy never changes. I just don't get it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Chris Jericho to host ABC game show Freefall starting June 22

Breaking News - CHRIS JERICHO NAMED HOST OF "DOWNFALL," THE HIGH STAKES AND HIGH DRAMA GAME SHOW PREMIERING JUNE 22 ON ABC | TheFutonCritic.com (http://www.thefutoncritic.com/news/2010/06/03/chris-jericho-named-host-of-downfall-the-high-stakes-and-high-drama-game-show-premiering-june-22-on-abc/20100603abc02/)

[Comey]

Chris Jericho to host ABC game show Freefall starting June 22

Breaking News - CHRIS JERICHO NAMED HOST OF "DOWNFALL," THE HIGH STAKES AND HIGH DRAMA GAME SHOW PREMIERING JUNE 22 ON ABC | TheFutonCritic.com (http://www.thefutoncritic.com/news/2010/06/03/chris-jericho-named-host-of-downfall-the-high-stakes-and-high-drama-game-show-premiering-june-22-on-abc/20100603abc02/)

Interesting, considering USA is part of NBC Universal. You would figure Jericho's contract (if he is still under WWE contract, I have no idea) would be a conflict of interest.

[SirFozzie]

Holy Shit Fucking DAMN!

2 hours and 50 minutes of Raw was a steaming turd.. the last ten minutes was.. the best angle of the last decade. No shit.

[DeToxRox]

Holy Shit Fucking DAMN!

2 hours and 50 minutes of Raw was a steaming turd.. the last ten minutes was.. the best angle of the last decade. No shit.

Danielson spitting on Cena and repeatedly yelling "YOU'RE NOT BETTER THEN ME!" was surreal. Also, him killing Justin Roberts was great. I have no high hopes this continues but since Cole got away unscathed I think it'd be great if he aligned himself with the NXT guys.

[RainMaker]

That was well done. Had completely lost interest in the WWE and have been fast forwarding through most Raw episodes. That last 15 minutes was amazing.

[Atocep]

My son watches everything WWE related so I caught a little bit of tonight's episode, but didn't see the end. I saw the dance off while I was making dinner and was amazed at how bad the show was getting. That combined with the MacGruber episode had me wondering how bad TNA was if it couldn't compete.

Since my son does watch religiously I have to maintain at least a passive interest in it and it's been getting incredibly hard to do. Hopefully this is a sign of things turning around. I'll have to watch his recording of the last 15 tonight.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I just watched the clip, been quite a while since I've heard a crowd that stunned into silence by an angle.

[RainMaker]

Justin Roberts getting choked out was pretty funny.

[Neon_Chaos]

That was awesome.

I am very hopeful about this angle.

[wade moore]

So. I had to contact the online support for Beachbody.com to try and cancel an order my wife made for some DVD's.

I go into the on-line chat and I get:

Hi, my name is Randy Orton. How may I help you?

It amused me greatly.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Ya' know, a lot of people don't like John Cena, but would you ever think that somebody like HHH or Undertaker would let himself be absolutely obliterated like that?

I think that's a very valid point, and it's one of the reasons my respect for Cena has grown considerably in the past couple of years.

At the end of the day, his job is the same as most everybody else's: do the best you can with the talent you have & keep your employer happy. It'd be hard IMO to reasonably argue that Cena doesn't meet those specs.

[Neon_Chaos]

I highly respect Cena the person for doing the shit he does day in and day out, and being a reliable company guy.

I, however, can't stand Cena the character. I feel that he's been forced down our throats as the plucky babyface for far too long, and is in need of a heel turn.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I, however, can't stand Cena the character. I feel that he's been forced down our throats as the plucky babyface for far too long, and is in need of a heel turn.

Thing is, at this point, I'm not sure that a heel turn for him would be the most productive way for the company to use him.

Walking around town I only see two kinds of wrestling merchandise on a regular basis: Cena shirts & Rey shirts. With the exception of my son's TNA shirts that don't get worn much any more, you simply don't see anything else.

That has more than a little value for Vince, in addition to there being some value in having a reliable face that you know you can plug into situations where you need one.

[DeToxRox]

So PWI is reporting that Dixie Carters big surprise for Slamiversary is sounding like a new creative member. They have contacted Heyman and Kevin Sullivan. I can't see how Sullivan helps. He knows how to book heels but he also has the "gimmicks on top, workers on bottom" philosophy that is the antithesis to TNA. Should be interesting regardless, but if Heyman agreed to come in it'd mean he has total authority.

[RainMaker]

I, however, can't stand Cena the character. I feel that he's been forced down our throats as the plucky babyface for far too long, and is in need of a heel turn.
A heel turn would be really fun for the fans, but I think it's overall bad for the WWE. He's good for business and gives the company a face that is very family friendly. He's the guy they can use on talk shows and for charitable events. I can't blame them for living him as an uber-babyface.

The problem has been that they have avoided anti-heroes for some time. They are going in that direction with Orton but inevitably will turn him full baby out of stupidity. The guys that are most interesting are the ones you shouldn't be cheering for but can't help doing so.

[DeToxRox]

So more from PWI on the TNA announcement. Apparently despite talking to Sullivan (which was confirmed) the announcement Dixie has has nothing to do with creative:


I reached out to TNA President Dixie Carter for clarification on the "TNA changes" comment that we've written about tonight. When asked about whether it would involve a creative change as we theorized earlier in the night, Carter responded none of the theories making the rounds were correct and the change was something on a much larger, grander scale. It was described to me as "true change."

While there is rampant discussion going on within the company about the situation (and we've heard a number of theories), the reality is no one in the company knows what Carter has up her sleeve as she hasn't disclosed it to anyone. Carter is holding all her cards extremely close to the vest, so no one knows what the true nature of what her tease is.

While Carter made it clear this situation is not something specifically designed for Slammiversary (although she did tease a surprise for that PPV, which apparently is a different matter), all of this certainly does add a lot of intrigue and mystique to this Sunday's PPV.

[DeToxRox]

Also, I have no idea if this is an angle or what but WWE.com is reporting Daniel Bryan has been released. I assume it is angle related, but wow if not.

[DeToxRox]

Dola, this is from the Observer:


Bryan Danielson, formerly Daniel Bryan and for about two minutes Bryan Danielson in WWE, appears to be Danielson again.
His WWE twitter name was just changed to Bryan Danielson and he mentioned it, saying "the winds of change are stirring."
WWE then announced Daniel Bryan had been future endeavored, which would be the first time they've used their web site to do a fake firing.

[DeToxRox]

Looks like this may be legit. A follow up from Alvarez:


A couple of late updates on the WWE & TNA news stories.
Within WWE, the word has been sent out internally that the Bryan Danielson firing is legitimate. All the higher-ups in the company were informed that he was gone before the item that everyone assumes to be a work was put on the web site. It's difficult to believe given the timing that it could possibly be legitimate. The idea they would work Donna Goldsmith and Michelle Wilson on a wrestling angle is also hard to fathom, and we've already seen examples of companies trying to work its employees and they are never good in the long-run.

[RainMaker]

Only took 5 days to blow their best storyline in years. Top notch WWE.

[DeToxRox]

And we have our reason why Danielson is gone:

Former WWE star Daniel Bryan was released today as punishment for going beyond the company's standards and practices during the NXT angle on Monday

[RainMaker]

Yeah, F4Wonline.com said it's for choking Justin Roberts with his tie. Wasn't this the company that recently had a storyline where Orton DDT'd HHH's wife and then kissed her unconcious body? Then had HHH break into Orton's home and attack him with a sledgehammer?

Then again, maybe this is just a big work and everyone will look like idiots when he comes out of the stands next Monday to attack someone.

[bulletsponge]

seriously? he had the 2 best promos and was in the best angle wwe had in a long time, and now hes gone. Vince must be hell bent on being mediocre

[Matthean]

seriously? he had the 2 best promos and was in the best angle wwe had in a long time, and now hes gone. Vince must be hell bent on being mediocre

And he's considered the best technical wrestler these days. TNA has to be drooling at getting him signed.

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[Maple Leafs]

Well, if he legit choked a guy who wasn't expecting it then he should be fired. But it seems odd to send a bunch of rookies out and tell them to act like they're out of control, then fire a guy for doing just that.

Was he the guy yelling "you're not better than me" at Cena? Wonder if that was it instead.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Was he the guy yelling "you're not better than me" at Cena?

I believe that would indeed be him.

[Matthean]

Was he the guy yelling "you're not better than me" at Cena? Wonder if that was it instead.

He was, but that's an even lamer excuse to have him get fired versus the one they are using now.

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[DeToxRox]

Well, if he legit choked a guy who wasn't expecting it then he should be fired. But it seems odd to send a bunch of rookies out and tell them to act like they're out of control, then fire a guy for doing just that.

Was he the guy yelling "you're not better than me" at Cena? Wonder if that was it instead.

PWI says it was for him choking Roberts which is a big no no after the Benoit thing. It's a PG company now sadly and he took it too far for their product. It sucks big time but I can see their point. I think he winds up back in WWE within the next few months before his no compete is up and TNA can sign him.

He is going to make huge money on the Indy's for a while until then, even if he can't do ROH shots. Some of those shows with just ex WWE guys draw like 3000 people.

[JonInMiddleGA]

While I believe the firing is just a work, it does lend itself to some speculation.
Imagine if you will
-- Heyman is given full creative control of TNA
-- Among the plans he's been asked to implement is some sort of ECW faction/reunion/angle
-- WWE just spent time putting over a guy who would have tremendous appeal to a big part of your long-term base, who have been steadily leaving in recent weeks
-- WWE fires a guy essentially for being "too extreme"

It'd be like Christmas in July.

Of course, if he really has been fired then the announcement of Kevin Sullivan being hired as head booker can't be far behind. Nothing good will come of that, which would be par for TNA's course.

[DeToxRox]

While I believe the firing is just a work, it does lend itself to some speculation.
Imagine if you will
-- Heyman is given full creative control of TNA
-- Among the plans he's been asked to implement is some sort of ECW faction/reunion/angle
-- WWE just spent time putting over a guy who would have tremendous appeal to a big part of your long-term base, who have been steadily leaving in recent weeks
-- WWE fires a guy essentially for being "too extreme"

It'd be like Christmas in July.

Of course, if he really has been fired then the announcement of Kevin Sullivan being hired as head booker can't be far behind. Nothing good will come of that, which would be par for TNA's course.

I wonder what Dixie's "huge" announcement is? If it is how their business will change, I can see potentially along the lines of them changing the name and branding of TNA, moving out of the Impact Zone for TV taping's (not sure if that is even possible right now) or maybe going public (can't see how that is feasible?)

At this point I am clueless but I am intrigued. It'll probably be nothing though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Does WWE actually believe Benoit went through anyone's mind* during that particular angle?

*(other than Phil Mushnick, who doesn't count since he's obsessed)

[DeToxRox]

Just saw this elsewhere but it's Meltzer on the Danielson situation:

What I was told if someone very important complained about the angle and it was the idea that kids watching may think it's fun to choke people with their ties.

He was a scapegoat. They want him back when it blows over.

What I don't know is where the complaint came from, but obviously it was someone very powerful, because even people internally now that it's out can't understand why they didn't wait until Tuesday and have Cena destroy him on Raw on Monday.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I wonder what Dixie's "huge" announcement is? If it is how their business will change, I can see potentially along the lines of them changing the name and branding of TNA, moving out of the Impact Zone for TV taping's (not sure if that is even possible right now) or maybe going public (can't see how that is feasible?)

Latest reports I've seen indicated that it was not related to creative, so that would eliminate Heyman/Sullivan as the topic. Hell it's probably the reformation of Benjamin/Haas or the hiring of some reality show star.

It'll probably be nothing though.

Almost certainly this. The last time she used that sort of hype it was the hiring of Ken Anderson (nee Kennedy)

That said however ... I wonder what the timing sequence of Danielson's (allegedly) being told he was fired versus her Twitter was? And whether a non-compete applies if he was indeed future endeavored.

[JonInMiddleGA]

re: "someone very important" -- Linda & her political campaign perhaps?

Which would make sense with regard to bringing him back when it blows over, it's really not that long until she's either won or lost that race.

[DeToxRox]

Latest reports I've seen indicated that it was not related to creative, so that would eliminate Heyman/Sullivan as the topic. Hell it's probably the reformation of Benjamin/Haas or the hiring of some reality show star.



Almost certainly this. The last time she used that sort of hype it was the hiring of Ken Anderson (nee Kennedy)

That said however ... I wonder what the timing sequence of Danielson's (allegedly) being told he was fired versus her Twitter was? And whether a non-compete applies if he was indeed future endeavored.

Johnson on PWI did say he believes there will be a debut or return at the show but he doesn't believe it'll be like Batista or anyone of that nature. I really don't know who it could be.

[JonInMiddleGA]

re: the Dixie surprise

According to reports, TNA’s upcoming changes are much larger than just a switch on the creative side. Dixie Carter has described the changes as “true change.”

The changes are all the talk within TNA right now but nobody really knows what Dixie is planning. Dixie is keeping quiet on what’s about to happen and only telling people “cryptic messages” about being on the same page.

The surprise planned for Slammiversary and the big changes she has been teasing are expected to be two different things.

Dixie wrote this on Twitter last night: “Just got off phone w/Spike prez Kevin Kay. He is all in and agrees this will change TNA on every level.”
New Details on TNA’s Major Changes Planned | WRESTLESCOOP.COM (http://www.wrestlescoop.com/2010/06/12/new-details-on-tnas-major-changes-planned/)


Here's a couple of thoughts, purely from my own top of mind
1) What's the status of Good Ol' JR's contract and/or non-compete?
2) Maybe a breakaway show or specified segment for the Knockouts?

[DeToxRox]

re: the Dixie surprise

According to reports, TNA’s upcoming changes are much larger than just a switch on the creative side. Dixie Carter has described the changes as “true change.”

The changes are all the talk within TNA right now but nobody really knows what Dixie is planning. Dixie is keeping quiet on what’s about to happen and only telling people “cryptic messages” about being on the same page.

The surprise planned for Slammiversary and the big changes she has been teasing are expected to be two different things.

Dixie wrote this on Twitter last night: “Just got off phone w/Spike prez Kevin Kay. He is all in and agrees this will change TNA on every level.”
New Details on TNA’s Major Changes Planned | WRESTLESCOOP.COM (http://www.wrestlescoop.com/2010/06/12/new-details-on-tnas-major-changes-planned/)


Here's a couple of thoughts, purely from my own top of mind
1) What's the status of Good Ol' JR's contract and/or non-compete?
2) Maybe a breakaway show or specified segment for the Knockouts?

1) He said on his blog he signed a new deal with WWE. It allows him to pursue outside broadcasting (MMA, football) but obviously not TNA.

2) Been rumored a while, I could see that.

I wonder if perhaps TNA is going getting some sort of prime time live specials like Clash of the Champions?

[JonInMiddleGA]

I wonder if perhaps TNA is going getting some sort of prime time live specials like Clash of the Champions?

Eh, doesn't really fit IMO, not based on the wording of her tweet about the head of Spike TV being all in, etc. To me it sounded more like she let him in on the change, rather than him being a major catalyst to the news.

[DeToxRox]

Eh, doesn't really fit IMO, not based on the wording of her tweet about the head of Spike TV being all in, etc. To me it sounded more like she let him in on the change, rather than him being a major catalyst to the news.

Good point. I never read that tweet until after I posted it. Could be something different with PPV's? Another rumor a while back was that she wanted to cut down on the number of PPV's they run to make them more important. I don't know why that would be a big change though.

Another thing I read on PWI earlier was along the lines of don't expect Shane McMahon to show up or anything, but I could see something like that tbqh. Well maybe I can't see it, but it fits.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Another thing I read on PWI earlier was along the lines of don't expect Shane McMahon to show up or anything, but I could see something like that tbqh. Well maybe I can't see it, but it fits.

Dana White?

I'm kidding but that would fit the description IMO.

[DeToxRox]

Dana White?

I'm kidding but that would fit the description IMO.

Yeah, I do agree though, I feel it makes sense for it to be like that. Perhaps she will announce a new investor (you know, a real one, not Mick Foley)?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yeah, I do agree though, I feel it makes sense for it to be like that. Perhaps she will announce a new investor (you know, a real one, not Mick Foley)?

http://www.synthstuff.com/mt/archives/ted-turner.jpg

:D

[bulletsponge]

im not buying Daniel getting fired over choking the announcer, he got fired for spitting on the golden boys face

[Terps]

Apparently Mattell were the ones who complained, and WWE would rather lose Danielson than a big money sponsor.

I've read that he'll be back when it all blows over though.

[DeToxRox]

Not even Dixie can be this dumb, but who knows, it does seem par the course for her "huge announcements". A few places are speculating that she will announce TNA will broadcast in 3D. Considering that like 20 people in TNA's audience probably have a 3DTV, I'd say this would be absurd on her TNA's part. It seems off though with the fact that she let Spike's president know about it, as I am assuming Spike would be involved in this from the outset and not just told it's happening.

[Matthean]

Apparently Mattell were the ones who complained, and WWE would rather lose Danielson than a big money sponsor.

I've read that he'll be back when it all blows over though.

Heard the interview where one insider talked about it and said it was somebody outside of the company forcing WWE's hand and Bryan was just the fall guy. Maybe was used a number of times in terms of describing if he was going to come back after a time.

Here's the download of the interview.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=BO6QFQ9Z

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[bulletsponge]

heres an online petition to sign to get Daniel reinstated. wont do much likely, but it will give you a chance to vent. i signed 2 times with my different email accounts :)

http://www.petitiononline.com/bdaniels/petition.html

[Matthean]

Not even Dixie can be this dumb, but who knows, it does seem par the course for her "huge announcements". A few places are speculating that she will announce TNA will broadcast in 3D. Considering that like 20 people in TNA's audience probably have a 3DTV, I'd say this would be absurd on her TNA's part. It seems off though with the fact that she let Spike's president know about it, as I am assuming Spike would be involved in this from the outset and not just told it's happening.

As mentioned in the interview I posted, 3D is too expensive for no real return outside of them saying they got to do it first. WWE added HD which cost them a bunch and their numbers didn't change. Rereading what Dixie is saying, she mentions Spike is giving it the thumbs up, so I'm wondering if it isn't ownership related.
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[RainMaker]

Is Mattel really that big of a sponsor? They seem to have a lot of sponsors on the show and I can't fathom they would have trouble finding replacements who would want to reach that audience demographic.

Just seems a little out there to have one sponsor destroy their product for a large percent of the fanbase.

I still think this has more to do with Linda's Senate campaign.

[molson]

Cena tweet regarding Danielson:

"I am very upset to hear about the release of bryan danielson. Social networks were formed so people would have a voice, and an opinon. I Know you all have your own, theories and whatnot. I respect that. I have never asked any of you to feel a certaint way about me. But Bryan left a lasting impression on the wwe universe in a very short time, and although it came at my expense, I agree with the majority Of you who are caught off guard by this choice."

That sure took a lot of steam out of the awesome NXT angle. I don't know. Maybe he comes back when whatever this is "blows over" but I somehow doubt it.

I'm assuming that he didn't just choke Roberts on his own, though I guess that's possible. If the workers are told to not "Benoit" anybody, than he needed to go because you can't have loose cannons on a live mainstream wrestling show doing their own thing.

[RainMaker]

The angle isn't lacking steam, it's dead.

[Matthean]

Is Mattel really that big of a sponsor? They seem to have a lot of sponsors on the show and I can't fathom they would have trouble finding replacements who would want to reach that audience demographic.

Just seems a little out there to have one sponsor destroy their product for a large percent of the fanbase.

I still think this has more to do with Linda's Senate campaign.

Mattel is a big sponsor, but they have been dealing with the WWE far too long for them to get mad about this. Even if they did, the WWE would hopefully back up their own talent. If this ruffled the feathers of somebody in Linda's campaign committee, then I can see where they felt less inclined to stick out their necks for him. It's one thing to piss off a sponsor. It's another to piss off the boss's wife.
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[RainMaker]

Exactly. I just don't see Mattel halting operations on all their WWE toys and ads because they wouldn't fire one guy who went too far during a segment.

[DeToxRox]

So regardining Dixie's announcement:

Dave Scherer at PWI received an anonymous e-mail (he cannot confirm it's validity obviously) but the idea intrigued him enough to post (he noted it is pure speculation at this point though the sender claims to be with TNA). Anyway, the e-mail stated that TNA will stop with PPV's altogether and instead do live shows on Spike instead.

This actually would make sense since most likely TNA doesn't draw big PPV buys, so they probably aren't making too much money and it doesn't open up their audience at all. assuming Spike pays them for the shows, they can make some money and draw in more viewers.

Would not be a bad move at all.

[Flasch186]

Clash of the Champions - Part Deux

I lyke it!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Anyway, the e-mail stated that TNA will stop with PPV's altogether and instead do live shows on Spike instead.

And they can do them with yet another addition to the roster that's better suited to be a road agent than a performer at this stage of their career.

Meanwhile Roxxi is gone (again) as of last night, followed by ODB's announcement that she's out of there effective immediately.

[DeToxRox]

Ha, as if people on the net weren't outraged enough, Raw ends with attempted vehicular homicide. Better hope no one in WWE goes nuts in the future Rampage Jackson style or else they'll lose that old favorite too.

[bulletsponge]

Ha, as if people on the net weren't outraged enough, Raw ends with attempted vehicular homicide. Better hope no one in WWE goes nuts in the future Rampage Jackson style or else they'll lose that old favorite too.

are you serious? im hoping it was Daniel behind the wheel

[ageofquarrel]

well looks like wwe waived Danielson's 90 day no compete clause. He is listed as appearing at Dragon Gate USA next month

[DeToxRox]

well looks like wwe waived Danielson's 90 day no compete clause. He is listed as appearing at Dragon Gate USA next month

I believe the no compete is in still applicable he just can't go to TNA or ROH.

[bulletsponge]

i think he cant appear on tv or and vidoes or ppv

[Toddzilla]

Goddamit Jay Lethal is fucking off the hook as Ric Flair. Simply unblievable.

I wonder if he's got any other impressions under his belt, because he's nailed Flair and Savage.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Surprising to see where Davey Richards is planning to retire later this year.

http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/article/roh-star-davey-richards-says-hes-retiring-later-this-year-104757



In a recent interview conducted for ScrippsNews.com, Ring of Honor star Davey Richards had the following to say about his decision to retire from pro wrestling this December. "I didn't plan to do this for my career. I've gotten done with paramedic school and have other things I want to concentrate on. I want to get my black belt in jiujitsu and finish the fire academy. I'm married now, too. Ring of Honor has so many talented guys that they don't need me anymore."

When asked about the possibility of returning from retirement as others have done in the past, Richards said, "First off, I hate to say I'm retiring. I'm just a small-town guy who wrestles. Ric Flair retires. Lou Thesz retires. For me, I'm just not going to show up anymore."

[ageofquarrel]

Surprising to see where Davey Richards is planning to retire later this year.

http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/article/roh-star-davey-richards-says-hes-retiring-later-this-year-104757



In a recent interview conducted for ScrippsNews.com, Ring of Honor star Davey Richards had the following to say about his decision to retire from pro wrestling this December. "I didn't plan to do this for my career. I've gotten done with paramedic school and have other things I want to concentrate on. I want to get my black belt in jiujitsu and finish the fire academy. I'm married now, too. Ring of Honor has so many talented guys that they don't need me anymore."




When asked about the possibility of returning from retirement as others have done in the past, Richards said, "First off, I hate to say I'm retiring. I'm just a small-town guy who wrestles. Ric Flair retires. Lou Thesz retires. For me, I'm just not going to show up anymore."


feel like he has been saying this for the last 2 years.

[DeToxRox]

Going out to see CHIKARA for the first time a week from Saturday. They are in Detroit and it's Danielson's first match back on the indy's, facing Eddie Kingston, a guy who is severely underrated.

[ageofquarrel]

have fun. I definitely take for granted living 20 minutes from the Arena.

[BigDPW]

G*ddamit Jay Lethal is f*cking off the hook as Ric Flair. Simply unblievable.

I wonder if he's got any other impressions under his belt, because he's nailed Flair and Savage.

Flipped by during that segment last night. It was hilarious in a wierd way though. It is sad seeing Flair flail all around and make a mockery of himself but funny that he would be willing to do that to put younger guys over...

Lethal is a pretty talented wrestler that can hold your attention with the comedy stuff. I think there is a real value to that as a midcard act...

[DeToxRox]

have fun. I definitely take for granted living 20 minutes from the Arena.

For sure, I am glad to see Chikara on the road. Having Dragon work this show is going to be huge for them as well with the extra crowd he'll most likely bring.

[Mota]

I have front row seats for Death Before Dishonor VIII tonight, looks like it could easily be the best Ring of Honor show this year, and quite frankly could be one of the best wrestling shows of the year period. The card is just STACKED, I can't wait!

[DeToxRox]

I have front row seats for Death Before Dishonor VIII tonight, looks like it could easily be the best Ring of Honor show this year, and quite frankly could be one of the best wrestling shows of the year period. The card is just STACKED, I can't wait!

Steen vs Generico is going to be nuts. The Steen/Corino vs Generico/Cabana feud has been fucking great. Some bloody, bloody shit.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Steen/Generico really should be off the hook, Kings vs Briscoes could be very good, and the Gauntlet might go well if it ends up with the right pairings.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Although I don't think I'm going to order, apparently the event is available on online PPV for $14.95 at GFL - GoFightLive - Ring of Honor - Death Before Dishonor VIII (http://www.gofightlive.tv/showEvent.do?eventId=690)

[DaddyTorgo]

for discussion:

hxxp://www.ugo.com/tv/wrestlings-greatest-gimmick-changes

the greatest gimmick changes in wrestling history

[BYU 14]

for discussion:

hxxp://www.ugo.com/tv/wrestlings-greatest-gimmick-changes

the greatest gimmick changes in wrestling history

Somehow Shockmaster seems badly out of place with the others....

I think Curt Hennig would be better served in his place.

[Mota]

RoH PPV tonight was amazing. Definitely the best live show I've ever been to and I've seen a lot. The RoH World Title match was unbelievable, 35 minutes of fantastic wrestling. Easily a contender for match of the year. If you didn't get the iPPV, order it now and watch it once it has been archived. The Tag Title match was also fantastic, pure mayhem throughout with 3 of the 4 guys bleeding. Mark Briscoe had the "crimson mask". Steen / Generico was also great.

Overall the feuds do seem to continue, but that's okay since we got good finishes for most of the matches. Can't wait to see how they follow this up.

[molson]

for discussion:

hxxp://www.ugo.com/tv/wrestlings-greatest-gimmick-changes

the greatest gimmick changes in wrestling history

I think there's two categories of gimmick changes. In one, a guy just starts playing another character with no relation to the first (Goldust, Raven).

In the other, it's actually a change - some kind of onscreen progression from one gimmick to another.

In the latter category, I nominate:

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[Toddzilla]

The best part of that video is Gene's thinly-veiled racism.

[DeToxRox]

Ha, Fatal Four Way (Edit - Couldn't remember the damn name of the show somehow) goes off air to a laid out Cena in the ring (with no announcers) and the crowd chanting Daniel Bryan loud as hell.

[BYU 14]

The best part of that video is Gene's thinly-veiled racism.

He was stradling the line a couple of times wasn't he?
"Renew my subscription to National Geographic" :)

[DeToxRox]

Saw Chikara tonight, awesome show. Danielson came out to the NXT theme song and was showered with ties instead of streamers. He and Kingston had a fun match to boot. Awesome all around show.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Given all the hype about the MCMG vs Beer Money ladder match & the (almost sure to be botched sooner rather than later) ECW invasion angle, we decided to watch Impact tonight.

As bad as Abyss beating up a side of beef with a barbed wire bat was, the backstage "brawl" between Taylor & Sarita was downright painful. You won't see as many poorly executed "punches", "kicks", and "weapon shots" at an outlaw indy show as they managed to have caught on camera in an interminable few minutes.

Damn I love to look at Taylor but not even her looks could overcome the massive fail of that segment. And now that they've come to the ring it hasn't improved much. Why is it so hard to figure out that you're supposed to play to your worker's strengths, not highlight their weaknesses?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Lord knows I find little good to say about TNA for a long while now but I thought they did a pretty good job of editing the end of the show tonight. Based on the spoilers I'd read (and went back & read again to see if I had missed something), it looks as though they may have added Dixie's bit from a different taping, which actually worked pretty well as a way to fade to black.

[Sun Tzu]

I watched TNA tonight. This marks the first time I've sat through an entire wrestling show since the WWE/ECW One Night Stand PPV.

I agree with JimGA that the ladies backstage were terrible. I've never been a big fan of female wrestling anyway, short of a good Beulah/Francine catfight. I thought the X-division match was just terrible. This Brian Kendrick kid seemed extremely green, and I noticed several badly missed spots throughout the match. The ladder match between Beer Run and MCMG was probably the best match of the night, at least IMO. I was a big ECW fan dating back to Barely Legal, so I liked the ending of the show for sure, especially considering I had no idea some of these guys were on the TNA roster. Hopefully the folks who write the storylines wont crap all over themselves like the WWF/WWE did with the invasion angle.

Also...what the hell happened to Scott Levy/Raven? Why does he look like he stopped working out and ate nothing but fast food and beer for 4 years straight?

[JonInMiddleGA]

I've never been a big fan of female wrestling anyway, short of a good Beulah/Francine catfight.

Please don't judge them on the basis of that disaster though. Taylor can work a fair bit, just not brawl style. She's not Dean Malenko but she's not anywhere near as bad as she looked.

This Brian Kendrick kid seemed extremely green, and I noticed several badly missed spots throughout the match.

Heh, given how long since you'd watched an entire show, Kendrick being unfamiliar really isn't surprising. But he's not green, just sloppy at times. That's a 31 y/o former WWE Tag Team Champion (w/Paul London), green really isn't an option for him at this stage of his career but he does seem to be one of the people that Dixie Carter might have meant when she slammed the roster for needing to tighten up their performances. He's also stuck in an feud and against an opponent that, IMO, really doesn't suit his style that well either.

I was a big ECW fan dating back to Barely Legal, so I liked the ending of the show for sure, especially considering I had no idea some of these guys were on the TNA roster.

Well some of them aren't on the roster, or rather hadn't been until recently. Ray & Devon are regulars, so is RVD for the past few months, Taz joined the broadcast crew in 2009, Foley came over last year as a part-time wrestler & part "owner" character. Rhino was a TNA mainstay for several years but has been virtually invisible in the company since the arrival of Hogan/Bischoff, July was his first TV appearance since March. Stevie Richards had a fairly short run of mostly non-wrestling appearances for TNA last year. Al Snow & Pat Kenney (aka Simon Diamond) are both road agents for TNA, while Dreamer recently arrived after his WWE release but hasn't wrestled yet. Meanwhile Raven had worked for TNA several times since their inception but has been gone. Other ECW alums who have some sort of TNA history but that haven't appeared in this latest angle yet would include Spike Dudley, Shane Douglas, Scott D'Amore, Sabu, and Jerry Lynn.

Also...what the hell happened to Scott Levy/Raven? Why does he look like he stopped working out and ate nothing but fast food and beer for 4 years straight?

For starters, he's almost 47, so some decline is probably natural. He's also not exactly known for living the healthiest lifestyle during at least the earlier parts of career so I'd imagine he's carrying more mileage than some of the other guys. He also hasn't been in the ring outside of a few indy appearances in more than a year.

[Sun Tzu]

Thanks for being so helpful. As odd as this sounds, you being helpful is probably going to lead to me watching TNA with some regularity now. I'm excited about Sabu being on the TNA roster...I had no idea. Is it true he shaved his head? What are the chances that Taz finally gets off his ass and back in the ring? What's the Sandman doing these days? Did the WWE completely drop the ECW brand? It seems like most of the ECW originals that were wrestling with the WWE have been released and signed elsewhere.

Bummer on Levy. I know he was getting up there in age, but he looks absolutely terrible. I mean if he could just trim down on the beer gut it would be an improvement, but as it is he looks like Jim Duggan without the guns and half cross-eye.

Regarding the ECW invasion angle...I'm not sure how this is going to work. I just can't see anyone in ECW going toe to toe with the Hulkster, maybe Taz or Shane but to me it sounds like they have been phased out wrestling wise.

[molson]

TNA can be a little disorganized and confusing at time, but my favorite thing about it is that the roster is so fluid. You never really know who you'll see. People are always coming and going. At some point, the WWE decided they needed a fixed "roster", so you see the same matches and wrestlers and angles over and over and over again.

TNA is kind of a mess, but at least it's a somewhat unpredictable mess.

[Sun Tzu]

I've tried to watch WWE shows over the last couple years, but I can't get through more than 20 minutes without turning it off. The WWE reminds me of Madden. They feel like they don't have any competition anymore, so they can serve you shit on toast and tell you it's a gourmet meal, and you have to either eat it or starve. I will never, ever, ever understand the whole hubub surrounding John Cena. Don't people get tired of seeing the extreme over-the-top political correctness, zip zilch squat for charisma, and the same 4 moves over and over?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Thanks for being so helpful. As odd as this sounds, you being helpful is probably going to lead to me watching TNA with some regularity now. I'm excited about Sabu being on the TNA roster...I had no idea. Is it true he shaved his head? What are the chances that Taz finally gets off his ass and back in the ring? What's the Sandman doing these days?

Sabu isn't on the roster currently, but he was a couple of years ago. Same w/ Franchise and the others I mentioned in that group.

Virtually no chance of seeing Taz in the ring afaik, his neck injury history makes that pretty much impossible to do safely as I understand it. Sandman officially retired in late '08, although he did work a couple of indy promotion matches about middle '09. He's pretty much completely shot physically as far as I could tell, all he had left was standing on the ringposts drinking beer & even that was sloppy.


Did the WWE completely drop the ECW brand? It seems like most of the ECW originals that were wrestling with the WWE have been released and signed elsewhere.

Yes, the brand was killed officially with the introduction of NXT. Most of them are now either unemployed or at least hanging around TNA.

Regarding the ECW invasion angle...I'm not sure how this is going to work. I just can't see anyone in ECW going toe to toe with the Hulkster, maybe Taz or Shane but to me it sounds like they have been phased out wrestling wise.

One of the questions is whether they'll have any interaction with Hogan. If you believe the 'net, TNA continues to negotiate with Paul Heyman to take a management role but he's consistently reported as holding out for total control or nothing at all. There doesn't seem to be any room for Heyman to co-exist with Hogan & Bischoff (since they have most of the creative control of TNA at the moment, with Russo essentially working for them or own his own with other angles), so something will have to give one way or the other.
I don't believe for a minute that Hogan et al can or will do anything ultimately worthwhile with any ECW angle, Heyman might at least have a chance to pull something off ... if you don't give him a checkbook ;)

[DeToxRox]

PWI said the ECW angle ends at the PPV. It's a one off deal and there are no plans to continue it after the show. That'd be classic TNA though; give up a ton of TV time and an entire PPV to a one off concept.

[Sun Tzu]

So...if that were the case, it's just a quick way to publicly introduce a few new workers to the roster? What the...

[Sun Tzu]

Oh it's not the quality of the wrestling, it's the lack of matches and absolutely god awful angles. I'd probably be ok with a second or third tier show like the old WCW Worldwide that had nothing but matches, but I have no idea when those shows are on.

[molson]

PPVs are also still wrestling-heavy. The WWE is still largely using the business model of using TV angles/interviews to sell PPV wrestling.

They're not worth $50 of whatever the hell they cost now, but if since you've sat out being a fan for so long, you might find some old PPV DVD rentals that might be worth tracking down.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Oh it's not the quality of the wrestling, it's the lack of matches and absolutely god awful angles. I'd probably be ok with a second or third tier show like the old WCW Worldwide that had nothing but matches, but I have no idea when those shows are on.

In terms of actual wrestling you're pretty much SOL with any of the national shows, they're very close to the same.

Here's a pretty detailed breakdown of the wrestling by company & show, covering the last 20 weeks
BEHIND THE NUMBERS: LOOKING BACK AT THE FIRST TWENTY WEEKS OF BY THE NUMBERS | PWInsider.com (http://www.pwinsider.com/article/49119/behind-the-numbers-looking-back-at-the-first-twenty-weeks-of-by-the-numbers.html?p=1)

The link breaks things down all sorts of ways but the bottom line is this:

Raw averages about 4.5 mins/match & 5.5 matches/show
SD averages 5.2 mins/match & 5 matches/show
NXT averages 4.4 mins/match & 2.7 matches/show
S'stars averages 5.9 mins/match & 3.5 matches/show
Impact averages about 4.5 mins/match & 5.65 matches/show

The most wrestling per hour average in the past 20 weeks has been 2 Raw specials (1x commercial free & 1x 3 hour episode) and 3 Smackdowns. This week's Impact would have cracked the top 5 but the bar isn't very high, they only averaged 17 mins/hour this week and that's their highest mark yet.

[Mota]

Cena's actually a solid wrestler. Not a great wrestler, but he can be in great matches with the right opponent. Yeah, his promos usually suck, but that's the fault of the writers they got, not him.

I think a lot of people overbash the WWE when it comes to the actual quality of their wrestling. Most main events on RAW or Smackdown are solid, it's unheard of that both of the World title matches on PPV are actually bad and if you're liable to get a solid matches on the second-tier shows like Superstars because people are actually given time.

I would recommend watching some Ring of Honor, Pro Wrestling Guerilla or even some stuff from Japan (NJPW, NOAH, Dragon Gate).

My son loves John Cena because he's very cartoony and tells lots of fart jokes, but in terms of actual wrestling quality it pales to a lot of stuff that's just outside the mainstream.

I still like the WWE but definitely watch it for a totally different experience, definitely not for the actual match quality.

[JonInMiddleGA]

RoH can be very good at times. PWG, Dragon Gate USA and Chikara also provide good wrestling talent but my problem with them all is lack of psychology.

To be sure RoH has awesome moments but their roster isn't what it was a couple of years ago.

I'm digging watching the first episode of Lucha Libre USA on MTV2 right now as I've only seen pieces of Lucha over the years and don't speak Spanish at all so I didn't know basics like the captain role in a trios match.

I had forgotten about this show, saw it mentioned earlier this week but it slipped my mind. Couldn't help but chuckle a little when I found the roster, which includes Marco Corleone (aka Mark Jindrak ex-WCW), Rellik (ex-TNA, ex-WCW as Johnny the Bull, ex-WWE as Johnny Stamboli), Chi Chi (aka Angry Allan Funk ex-WCW), Tigressa Caliente (aka Trenesha Biggers aka Rhaka Kahn ex-TNA),and RJ Brewer (aka John Walters from the indies). The chuckle really came when I realized that AAA regular Charley Manson has been renamed as Charley Malice.

Considering the non-mini roster is about 16 people, that's a pretty high number of castoffs, although Jindrak has supposedly found his niche after working south of the border for several years now. There are a few legit luchadores mixed in -- Tineblas Jr, Lizmark, Jr, Mascarita Sagrada (as Mascarita Dorada), Halloween -- but this has potential to be pretty bad stuff.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I actually do watch all of the above and my opinion remains the same. No, Cena's never going to pull out a 60-minute broadway (unless he's against HBK again), but he's a good wrestler in his style and can have a great match against a good opponent. Just for example, his match against Umaga at the RR would be a good match no matter the era or fed it happened in.

Careful, something bad is gonna happen if we agree on much ;)

The Cena discussion a few pages back pretty much covered my thoughts, I've developed a good bit of respect for what Cena has done & what he brings to the table.

[rjolley]

When are they going to turn Cena heel? I know he's their top face, but it would be a very interesting move to turn him heel, maybe to lead his new group from NXT.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Better than I expected. The Trios match was pretty solid, the minis tag was good enough, and the main event could have been good if they'd drop the stupid jelly donut bit.

Doing some reading tonight during this discussion, appears that Fat Jelly Donut Guy is someone who trained at the school in Atlanta where Jindrak worked for a couple of years. I suspect that explains his contract.

Haven't seen anything about Rellik unless he's one of the random renames.
I've seen him mentioned in a couple of spoilers & sure enough he's there on the roster page
Roster : (http://luchalibreusa.com/?cat=9)

I liked Funk as a worker back in the day and can't believe that was him tonight. Really working the gimmick.

Kwee Wee amped up is what I gather.

[molson]

Speaking of Cena, I miss that part of his run where he was booked as a hugely sympathetic face, but was treated by the fans as a hated heel. A heel turn would have been predictable there, but the WWE just kept trotting him out as the same babyface character (while openly acknowledging the fan hate), culminating in the One Night Stand PPV where they KNEW their golden boy would be boo'd out of the arena.

That was the last time WWE booking was interesting....It's been just kind of paint-by-numbers since then.

But as for Cena, he won the fans back and has been a consistently solid performer his entire run.

[thesloppy]

Kwee Wee.

Don't get me excited.

[Sun Tzu]

Loved Tommy's speech on Impact...love

[Sun Tzu]

Right but...tell us how you really feel.

[JonInMiddleGA]

From today's New York Times of all places

Abdullah the Butcher Sustains a Wrestling Career - NYTimes.com (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/26/sports/26wrestler.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1)

[molson]

From today's New York Times of all places

Abdullah the Butcher Sustains a Wrestling Career - NYTimes.com (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/26/sports/26wrestler.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1)

Have you ever been down to his restaurant in Atlanta?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Have you ever been down to his restaurant in Atlanta?

Once, maybe 10 years ago.

Kinda so-so food (I'm not much for ribs & that's supposed to be his best) but cool for a few minutes in a kitschy way. Kind of a bucket list sort of thing for a wrestling fan but not something I'd recommend on the basis of dining alone. He was engaged in a conversation with someone that didn't look wise to interrupt so we ate, looked around at some old pictures on the wall, and left.

[Toddzilla]

I'd have to bring home a fork :)

[Matthean]

ECW. ECW. ECW (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsfGySha9uw&videos=9qsGSRchrtQ)

Hopefully leads to Macho Man being in the Hall (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/281852595.shtml)

[Sun Tzu]

Tommy Dreamer could kick your butt.

I'm also pretty sure that his dad could beat up your dad.

[DeToxRox]

His dad probably could. Dreamer can't walk down a ramp without hurting himself. ECW had some great, innovative aspects to it. Dreamer was indicative of the garbage fans winning out and the real workers leaving/being signed away.

From a purely in ring standpoint, the downfall of ECW was Heyman strapping the rocket to Justin Credible. Credible was okay but he should not have been pushed as hard as he was, he just wasn't ready and couldn't handle it. It helped speed up the process as far as ECW dying.

[Sun Tzu]

Tox has a point...at least Dreamer could rouse up some drama. Credible was a missed spot (or five) waiting to happen.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Credible was a missed spot (or five) waiting to happen.

As opposed to the blown spot king of all-time RVD?

[JonInMiddleGA]

RVD's blown spots are athletic/entertaining.

FTR I kind of got what they were shooting for with Credible, it worked for me a little but not a lot, so it's not as though I was a fan of his. But in terms of Blown Spots, RVD was about as bad as I can recall seeing although I'll admit to the possibility of being influenced by watching him screw up repeatedly in person at Wrestlepalooza '98.

[DeToxRox]

I loved RVD but his matches were very repetitive, and he wasn't the blown spot King, he was the second in command though. Sabu was Mr. Blown Spot but he was doing some wonky stuff.

At the end of ECW the talent wasn't there and I think Heyman was trying his hardest to make lightning strike.

Funny story from the guys at PWI (who were there running ECW.com) but Christopher Daniels showed up in the last year and worked a few shots. He was over with the crowd but someone (intimated to be Dreamer) said he had an awful look and couldn't ever get over. Daniels is great in all facets but his look is holding him back. Still I think he could have been huge for ECW if given the chance. It's unlikely things would have been different but it is something I wonder about.

[Sun Tzu]

I find wrestling is much less exciting when you have already read all the spoilers. Bleh

I have to say I was quite impressed by the Motor City...somethingorother. Those boys can wrestle.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sabin & Shelley, aka The Motor City Machineguns, are a couple of guys who came from the indys into TNA and probably should have gotten bigger than they ended up. They've have had some problems with heat in the back (reportedly of course) and that's held them back at times IMO.

[spleen1015]

Stopped and watched a little RAW last night. I saw Golddust lose to some Celtic dude named Sheamus that is the champ right now.

Is this Golddust the same one? Dustin Rhodes I think?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Stopped and watched a little RAW last night. I saw Golddust lose to some Celtic dude named Sheamus that is the champ right now. Is this Golddust the same one? Dustin Rhodes I think?

That'd be him.

[Mota]

Samoa Joe has been suspended from TNA for 1 month. That is ridiculous, TNA should be worshipping this guy and instead he gets buried under crap like Kevin Nash, Raven, Tommy Dreamer and Hulk Hogan. What year is it anyways?

The scary thing is that TNA's top talent that they should be pushing are so damaged by now after years of abuse that I'm not sure if they can be properly elevated. Guys like the Motor City Machine Guns, Samoa Joe, AJ Styles, etc. These are the guys that TNA should revolve around, but instead they get to play on the periphery as Dixie is enthralled by the big names of legacy WWE guys who are years past their prime.

It's sad that the WWE seem to be the ones pushing new talent recently, and believe it or not their ratings are increasing. Young people will relate to new emerging talent, it's just the way that life goes. It's just like music, you'll always love the music you first got laid to. In TNA the kids can't relate to these guys because it's like hero worshipping someone's dad and not someone cool.

[DeToxRox]

Shane McMahon was named CEO of China Broadband today.

[Matthean]

Samoa Joe has been suspended from TNA for 1 month. That is ridiculous, TNA should be worshipping this guy and instead he gets buried under crap like Kevin Nash, Raven, Tommy Dreamer and Hulk Hogan. What year is it anyways?

The scary thing is that TNA's top talent that they should be pushing are so damaged by now after years of abuse that I'm not sure if they can be properly elevated. Guys like the Motor City Machine Guns, Samoa Joe, AJ Styles, etc. These are the guys that TNA should revolve around, but instead they get to play on the periphery as Dixie is enthralled by the big names of legacy WWE guys who are years past their prime.

It's sad that the WWE seem to be the ones pushing new talent recently, and believe it or not their ratings are increasing. Young people will relate to new emerging talent, it's just the way that life goes. It's just like music, you'll always love the music you first got laid to. In TNA the kids can't relate to these guys because it's like hero worshipping someone's dad and not someone cool.

You know TNA's ratings are going up and they had their highest ratings since Feb.? On another forum they even mention how much better TNA is getting by using the young guys and they have been on an upward swing as of late, hence the ratings increase.

Source (http://www.tnawrestlingnews.com/headlines/282593834.shtml)

EDIT: If Joe got suspended, then there was likely a good reason and it wasn't "because we need to push the old guys."

[JonInMiddleGA]

On the bright side, TNA has confirmed the signing of Too Cold Scorpio for the PPV.

Damn, I bet the price of pot around Orlando has skyrocketed in recent weeks.

[JonInMiddleGA]

You know TNA's ratings are going up and they had their highest ratings since Feb.?

Umm, they're ratings have been largely flat for months, only now getting back to where they were in 2008 and even parts of 2007. There was indeed a noticeable bump last week but it's been attributed almost entirely to kids age 12-17. Not sure that's something they can count on lasting long.

[JonInMiddleGA]

EDIT: If Joe got suspended, then there was likely a good reason and it wasn't "because we need to push the old guys."

The reason making the rounds is that he pretty much exploded after the old "30 seconds remaining" announcement was made during his recent match vs Hardy and completely telegraphed the finish.

No confirmation on whether it really was Russo who ordered the announcement made, but that's one of the rumors that's been floating, although it was the production staff that Joe took most of his anger out on.

In reality, Joe is suspended because there's not a soul in charge at TNA who has the slightest idea what the fuck they're doing.

[CU Tiger]

John...for a casual fan can you explain your last post?
I just went and checked out the youtube video..not sure I get it.

Was he not expecting to show a draw?
And how did he telegraph the finish?

I may just be missing it...just not seeing anything there at all?

[JonInMiddleGA]

John...for a casual fan can you explain your last post? I just went and checked out the youtube video..not sure I get it.
Was he not expecting to show a draw? And how did he telegraph the finish?
I may just be missing it...just not seeing anything there at all?

Borash makes the 30 seconds announcement, which pretty much assured long time fans what the outcome of the match was going to be. At the :12/:13 mark, check out the look that Joe shoots over his shoulder toward the general direction of where Borash was standing.

Not making an announcement was something that had (reportedly of course) been discussed prior to the match, a point that Joe was apparently adamant about.

IMO, as soon as fans heard there was a time limit, the outcome was fairly predictable with or without Borash reminding them of it. Certainly the announcement was a huge verbal neon arrow of what was coming, whereas it's possible that at least the live audience might have been distracted enough by the match to have been caught off guard by the eventual occurrence of the time limit expiring & given a better reaction.

That said, if the reports are accurate, the point that set Joe off backstage seems more likely to me to have been thinking there the issue of the :30 warning had been settled beforehand, only to have gotten swerved by his own backstage crew.

[Mota]

When I was a teenager I used to go to a ton of shows by International Wrestling which was the Quebec regional fed with the Rougeaus, Rick Martel, Dino Bravo, Gino Brito, etc. They used to call the time limit before every match and would also call every 5 minutes how much time was left. It would actually build the suspense as you'd come closer to the time limit. But in today's world if you call the time limit it does become painfully obvious that they're going to a draw or within seconds of one as that's the only time they mention it.

Matthean, I wouldn't really consider them on a youth movement right now, they're going to a PPV filled with 40+ year olds that haven't been in the spotlight for over 10 years in many cases. I couldn't name one guy that they have developed in the last two years ... Matt Morgan is improving but he's still a pretty crappy wrestler and they're not protecting him at all, he's losing all the time recently. The Pope would be close even though he's ex-WWE but they have remade him to their credit. He's had some injury problems though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Multiple online sources reporting that Jerry Lynn has been forced to pull out of tomorrow night's PPV main event due to a back injury.

No one seems to know what they'll do to replace him, and I suspect that "no one" includes Tommy Dreamer.

[DeToxRox]

It's being reported ROH World Champion has signed a deal with WWE. Black is a good worker but cannot talk at all. Interested to see what they do with him.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Dixie Carter tweeted last hour ... main event is RVD vs Sabu

[JonInMiddleGA]

Gonna be a little weird tonight, probably half the guys original names are owned by Vince. So far Tony Mamaluke has become Tony Luke and Johnny Swinger is now just Swinger.

But the "Where's My Pizza?" chant for the FBI is still in play :)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Taz: "Not surprising we'll hear from Simon Diamond here ... Pat Kinney is blown up"

[Sun Tzu]

Uh...what time does HJ actually start? 8 or 9 EST

[JonInMiddleGA]

It's underway now ... opened with FBI vs Kash/Swinger/Diamond

Now we're getting little Where Are They Now vignettes ... first one features thank yous from Tod Gordon, Gary Wolfe (Pitbull #1), and Blue Meanie.

[Sun Tzu]

hmm...I'm having issues finding a half-way decent justin.tv feed with this. Cable out here (Hawai'i) is a joke.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Damn Fonzie looks & sounds bad. Did he have a stroke or something?

[JonInMiddleGA]

"P.J. Polanco", although I think he looks more in shape than Justin Credible.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Where Are They Now vignette with Francine (w/ her 1 y/o baby).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Okay, let's be honest, the quality is pretty bad in terms of workrate. It's all in good fun & the nostalgia is a decent ride but other than 2 Cold and Kash, the years have not been particularly kind.

Next up: Rhino vs Spike Dudley vs Al Snow