WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

[Double Deuce]

Hey all, dunno how many pay attention to this, but when you look at stats of simmed players at the end of a season, there are always a CRAZY number of relievers with over 100+ innings pitched, and a ton of games played.

In reality, most full-season relievers may get around 60 innings, some maybe getting into the 80s. Rarely higher than that.

I've been looking for a way to fix this in Franchise mode by tweaking settings, etc. but have yet to come up with anything. I noticed that setting the slider for CPU Starter Stamina DOES impact the innings pitched of starters even when simming, but doing the same to CPU Reliever Stamina does not seem to (at least not enough that I noticed a difference in overall reliever IP at the end of the seasons I simmed).

Does anyone know a way to address this, aside from going into each individual reliever and editing their stamina and/or durability?? This has been an issue in the series for as long as I remember, and I keep expecting them to address it, but it never happens. In past years I've been a crazy person and edited reliever stamina by hand for every reliever in the game, but I just can't bring myself to do that again this year.

Anyone solved this, or have good ideas on what might work? Thanks!

[thedude]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

Are you sure it's that starters aren't going deep enough in games, or is it that the CPU is always using the same relievers?

[Double Deuce]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

Are you sure it's that starters aren't going deep enough in games, or is it that the CPU is always using the same relievers?

The starters' innings pitched seem about right, but yeah the same relievers are getting used WAY too often. It seems like their stamina is recovering too quickly, so they are "ready" too often. In real life, if a reliever pitches a few days in a row, the manager will make sure to give him a rest day.

I've cranked the injury slider to the max, to try and either slow down the stamina recharge, or cause the "main" relievers to get hurt more often and give other relievers a chance to get called up and gain some innings. But that hasn't seemed to work well either, despite there being more injuries overall.

They're just too damn durable.

[Double Deuce]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

Now that I think more about it, I wonder if the issue is that the CPU is just choosing to pitch the highest rated relievers on the team as much as possible, despite their actual in-game results. The CPU doesn't pay attention to stats when making decisions on who to put in, I don't think, it's purely ratings. So maybe the same guys are getting used all the time because the CPU doesn't care if they're not effective, where in real life a manager would give a struggling reliever a break, maybe try to get him some low-leverage innings to get him straightened out. Or even send him down if he's struggling. That doesn't seem to happen with the CPU.

[Archie56]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

It's not just simulation either. I do believe the CPU uses the best reliever available based on ratings. I just had a 3 game series against the Cards and every single game I saw Wainwright come into the game in relief, and all 3 games he pitched 2-3 innings. Now I know he was a starter so his stamina might be better than a regular reliever but still. Plus he's getting up there in age so I'm sure he tires out quicker than he used to.

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[DarthRambo]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

This is a legacy issue that's plagued the game forever. If you notice when playing the cpu will bring in in the LRP any time they are losing. Only way they use the SU pitchers is if they're ahead. Tie game late? Bring in the LRP smh. They also will leave in a reliever when he's obviously getting shelled if they were already losing. The logic is God awful and not sure if they'll ever even look to fix it since it's always been this way.

What I do is switch the controller over and manage their bullpen for them most games. While I'm batting I switch over and schedule a pitcher for the cpu to enter next half inning. As soon as I get my 3rd out pitching, I switch over before game comes back so it asks me if I want to still put in new pitcher (for AI team). Then switch back to my team to hit.


That's the only somewhat fix for games played. If you really want to get into it then you'd have to manage every game on the calendar and manage both bullpens through the manage simulation.

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[kinsmen7]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

I'm not 100% sure if it's the same as 21, but with 20, AI bullpen usage has always been an issue. There's an old thread here somewhere that discusses the optimal way to set up your bullpen if you're a sim-player. I feel like the suggestion was:

2 x long reliever
4 x mid-reliever
1 x set-up
1 x closer

I think sliders are also involved when it comes to actual gameplay, but I really can't remember...I've pretty much been running with the same slider set for a year and haven't really thought about them since. I'd suggest trying to find the actual thread though-It's very helpful.

[JTommy67]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

You can alleviate this by controlling all the teams yourself and keeping their bullpen lineup adjusted. Make sure nobody is in the setup slots and from time to time you can rotate the relievers through the other slots to even things out. But you have to maintain 32-team control. If you leave it back to the cpu each bullpen will get reset upon the first injury.

IrishSalsa is dead on. This is an aggravating legacy issue they obviously don't care to fix. I don't suspect it or anything else affecting franchise mode will ever be addressed.

[DarthRambo]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

This is by far the most aggravating issue with this game that is probablyleast talked about or brought up to be fixed. A lot just cause it's forever been an issue. But really the way it affects gameplay for simulation purposes is possibly game breaking IF you actually played all 162 games and the playoffs.

The amount of games you will win because of AI incompetence over 162 games easily could be those extra wins needed for the division title or a wildcard spot. Maybe you're wanting to play with the Pirates and rebuild. Those extra wins could be the difference of a #1 pick or not. I know kinda extreme examples but honestly if you play enough games you'll get some cheap wins from the AI bullpen logic being so poor.


There is a way to set up each team's bullpen using 30 team control. I can't remember exactly. It works fairly well but not perfect. If anyone knows for sure what it was can you let us know?

Biggest issue with doing that is when injuries occur to their relievers you almost have to manage that for them too.

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[bspring3]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

There is clearly an issue with BP usage in the game but I think there is another issue that is contributing and making it all worse.

I do play 1 and sim 5 for my franchise and it’s not uncommon for me to start my played game and see most of my relievers at half stamina. With the game changing to SP only going around 5 innings (or two times thru the lineup), it seems like SP stamina ratings in the game reflect this change.

However, teams in real life frequently are sending down and calling up the 5th starter and the lower bullpen arms to keep guys fresh. So while a MLB bullpen may consist of a collection of 10 arms with 4 of them being cycled between AAA and MLB, the Show never does this sort of thing: teams stick with their 7 or 8 man bullpen. This exasperates the issue with LRP getting too many innings and RP constantly pitching tired.

All that being said, the main issue is still the LRP getting high leverage innings instead of the top RP.


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[Siuflyer]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

Yep. Legacy issue that will never be fixed because SDS has no incentive to do so. Same with simulated stats. They could add sim sliders, like 2K did, and allow the users to do the work for them but even that is way too much to ask.

[Double Deuce]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

Thanks for the responses guys. I'll adjust the roles in each team's BP (I do have 30 team control but am only "playing" as one team... even though I rarely actually play the games) and see if that helps, and I guess I'll just check them periodically and set them back if the CPU messes with them after an injury. I think I may also just monitor other teams' pitchers and send down/release and replace guys who are not performing, like teams would do in real life.


It's crazy this has never been fixed. In years past I've literally gone through every reliever in the game and edited their stamina or durability down, but life is too busy for that level of neuroticism now.

[DarthRambo]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

Thanks for the responses guys. I'll adjust the roles in each team's BP (I do have 30 team control but am only "playing" as one team... even though I rarely actually play the games) and see if that helps, and I guess I'll just check them periodically and set them back if the CPU messes with them after an injury. I think I may also just monitor other teams' pitchers and send down/release and replace guys who are not performing, like teams would do in real life.


It's crazy this has never been fixed. In years past I've literally gone through every reliever in the game and edited their stamina or durability down, but life is too busy for that level of neuroticism now.

Lowering stamina won't fix the problem. The AI doesn't care if the pitcher has 0 stamina. They'll still leave him in to get shelled if they are already losing by even one run or more.



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[BodamEscapePlan]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

This is a legacy issue that's plagued the game forever. If you notice when playing the cpu will bring in in the LRP any time they are losing. Only way they use the SU pitchers is if they're ahead. Tie game late? Bring in the LRP smh. They also will leave in a reliever when he's obviously getting shelled if they were already losing. The logic is God awful and not sure if they'll ever even look to fix it since it's always been this way.

What I do is switch the controller over and manage their bullpen for them most games. While I'm batting I switch over and schedule a pitcher for the cpu to enter next half inning. As soon as I get my 3rd out pitching, I switch over before game comes back so it asks me if I want to still put in new pitcher (for AI team). Then switch back to my team to hit.


That's the only somewhat fix for games played. If you really want to get into it then you'd have to manage every game on the calendar and manage both bullpens through the manage simulation.

Sent from my SM-G996U using Operation Sports mobile app

This is actually a great workaround as long as you don't mind doing it. Thank you for posting this as this is something that will make the game a lot more fun for me.

[DarthRambo]

Re: WAY too many relief innings/appearances when simming seasons

It really isn't bad to do and takes little effort. Hard part is remembering to help them out before they bring in the LRP or something dumb.

And actually with the 3 batter rule now it makes managing it easier cause I know if I bring in a guy for them they will not immediately yank him for the LRP after one batter (if they're losing) as they did in previous years of this game.

I personally enjoy the game a ton more doing this. I can actually create some lefty v lefty and righty vs righty at bats, something that is extremely rare for the AI to do.

Not a problem for sharing! Hope you give it a try and enjoy your game experience doing it.

This is actually a great workaround as long as you don't mind doing it. Thank you for posting this as this is something that will make the game a lot more fun for me.

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