From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34?? - Operation Sports Forums

From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

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  • CSilver355
    Rookie
    • Apr 2015
    • 18

    #1

    From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

    This is just ridiculous. I have simmed my Padres RTTS just to see the how player ratings would turn out like. So, Shields went from a 92 overall all the way down to 74 just because he's 34. The crazy decrease in overall ratings only seems to go down dramatically when that player hits 34 and above. Its not realistic at all though especially since Shields had a 20-4 season with a 2.73 ERA and won the Cy Young and the following year (2016) he is being used as a long reliever. Wil Nieves went from about a 72 all the way down to a 54. COME ON MAN. Just because a player is old does not mean his attributes should drop like that! A lot of the times its the complete opposite. The older the player the better their numbers get. Well, for hitters mostly but it seems this game is set up to make players lose ridiculous points in their overall just because they are "old." Hope this gets fixed somehow someway.
  • MLB Bob
    MVP
    • Jan 2011
    • 1008

    #2
    Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

    Originally posted by CSilver355
    This is just ridiculous. I have simmed my Padres RTTS just to see the how player ratings would turn out like. So, Shields went from a 92 overall all the way down to 74 just because he's 34. The crazy decrease in overall ratings only seems to go down dramatically when that player hits 34 and above. Its not realistic at all though especially since Shields had a 20-4 season with a 2.73 ERA and won the Cy Young and the following year (2016) he is being used as a long reliever. Wil Nieves went from about a 72 all the way down to a 54. COME ON MAN. Just because a player is old does not mean his attributes should drop like that! A lot of the times its the complete opposite. The older the player the better their numbers get. Well, for hitters mostly but it seems this game is set up to make players lose ridiculous points in their overall just because they are "old." Hope this gets fixed somehow someway.
    well not since steroids are tested more. Players do fall and become nothing out of no where, and it happens rapidly..we all can name someone that didnt but if you look you can name 10 more that did. But I think its a little too universal in the game..but they added the "stats" based progression thing..

    Comment

    • thescottyglasgow
      Rookie
      • Mar 2013
      • 175

      #3
      Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

      Originally posted by CSilver355
      This is just ridiculous. I have simmed my Padres RTTS just to see the how player ratings would turn out like. So, Shields went from a 92 overall all the way down to 74 just because he's 34. The crazy decrease in overall ratings only seems to go down dramatically when that player hits 34 and above. Its not realistic at all though especially since Shields had a 20-4 season with a 2.73 ERA and won the Cy Young and the following year (2016) he is being used as a long reliever. Wil Nieves went from about a 72 all the way down to a 54. COME ON MAN. Just because a player is old does not mean his attributes should drop like that! A lot of the times its the complete opposite. The older the player the better their numbers get. Well, for hitters mostly but it seems this game is set up to make players lose ridiculous points in their overall just because they are "old." Hope this gets fixed somehow someway.
      I agree I have been talking about progression for years I always get mike trout and just sim until he is 30 or something and no matter what he already decreasing across the board it is like it is preset I cant remember what age maybe 28 he just starts decreasing no matter what you do.

      Comment

      • braves_94
        Rookie
        • Jul 2013
        • 275

        #4
        Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

        Originally posted by MLB Bob
        well not since steroids are tested more. Players do fall and become nothing out of no where, and it happens rapidly..we all can name someone that didnt but if you look you can name 10 more that did. But I think its a little too universal in the game..but they added the "stats" based progression thing..
        I just don't agree with this at all. Most players go through a slow decline unless injuries occur. It's rare a player hits an ability wall. Rare. BJ Upton? Though Albert Pujols isn't living up to his massive deal, he's still a productive player. Nothing that would warrant a huge slide in game ratings. Joey Hamilton? His body is deteriorating due to injuries. In fact, most of the decline player's experience is due to bodies that can no longer hold up to a 162 game schedule. But when healthy they still are good players. Alex Rodriguez. Players just don't suck one day. It makes no sense. Derek Jeter fell off after breaking his ankle. It took 6 injuries to finally do in Griffey. Ryan Howard was a negative player due to his defense before signing that monster extension. Dan Uggla, suffered a severe concussion and was never the same. Same for Marcus Giles. So I can rattle of 50 players that had typical regression compared to those who just get old and hit a ratings free fall.

        Comment

        • CSilver355
          Rookie
          • Apr 2015
          • 18

          #5
          Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

          That's horrible! Trout's overall should not be going down at the age of 28. That actually is a time when most players are hitting their "prime." Hopefully they fix this because it honestly takes the fun out of playing a long term RTTS/Franchise. Like you said though no matter what it will happen because I just re-edited Shields in a roster and made him 99 overall. Started a new RTTS simulated and the next season he was a 79. He had another great season record of 19-6 with a 2.88 ERA but his overall still went down like crazy and he ended up as a reliever. AGAIN. Please fix this!

          Comment

          • Potatoes002
            MVP
            • Jul 2008
            • 2142

            #6
            Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

            I wish the regression wasn't so dramatic for older players still playing very well.

            Comment

            • ajblithe20
              Pro
              • Feb 2013
              • 845

              #7
              Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

              Originally posted by braves_94
              I just don't agree with this at all. Most players go through a slow decline unless injuries occur. It's rare a player hits an ability wall. Rare. BJ Upton? Though Albert Pujols isn't living up to his massive deal, he's still a productive player. Nothing that would warrant a huge slide in game ratings. Joey Hamilton? His body is deteriorating due to injuries. In fact, most of the decline player's experience is due to bodies that can no longer hold up to a 162 game schedule. But when healthy they still are good players. Alex Rodriguez. Players just don't suck one day. It makes no sense. Derek Jeter fell off after breaking his ankle. It took 6 injuries to finally do in Griffey. Ryan Howard was a negative player due to his defense before signing that monster extension. Dan Uggla, suffered a severe concussion and was never the same. Same for Marcus Giles. So I can rattle of 50 players that had typical regression compared to those who just get old and hit a ratings free fall.
              I'm not sure I agree with you point, but just to add to it... Ryan Howard did suffer a torn achilles in his final at bat of the 2011 season. So he missed some time in 2012 and had knee problems after that as well. So you can count Howard's sudden regression as having at least something to do with injuries

              Comment

              • MLB Bob
                MVP
                • Jan 2011
                • 1008

                #8
                Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                Has any one with an issue taken a look or researched what typical aging curves look like? O attempted to look at actual stats and not base it of memory and their own biased evaluation? Theres a whole internet full of information. I decided to take a look to see for myself. People tend to remember and site every player thats still playing..the elite and the best of the best and how they are declining from super human to al stars and thats not a big decline..but what about all the guys that arent playing anymore? The guys people wrote off? I went to fan graphs and pulled a list and looked at their aging curves. Velocity and K rate for pitchers actually does fall off a cliff in the early to mid 30's. Power for hitters doesnt decline the same but a lot of other skills, ie speed, defense, bat speed etc and you see drops of 2-3 WAR over a 2-3 year period in mid 30's. I can agree not everyone is 34 on the dot but its not what most people want in the game..

                Comment

                • braves_94
                  Rookie
                  • Jul 2013
                  • 275

                  #9
                  Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                  If I was to do regression: Players would peak around 26, 27, 28. Then regression would be more noticeable in certain attributes than others; contact, speed, durability. I can understand a drop like 12 points over three years from their prime. A 99 would still be 87. And an 80, who likely was a fringe starter in him prime would be a 68 by time they 31. Then from 31 until their durability depletes or suffer a serious injury, have the rating decline slowly. Jimmy Rollins was an MVP in his prime. And from 30 to 35 was mostly the same player.

                  Comment

                  • thescottyglasgow
                    Rookie
                    • Mar 2013
                    • 175

                    #10
                    Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                    Originally posted by MLB Bob
                    Has any one with an issue taken a look or researched what typical aging curves look like? O attempted to look at actual stats and not base it of memory and their own biased evaluation? Theres a whole internet full of information. I decided to take a look to see for myself. People tend to remember and site every player thats still playing..the elite and the best of the best and how they are declining from super human to al stars and thats not a big decline..but what about all the guys that arent playing anymore? The guys people wrote off? I went to fan graphs and pulled a list and looked at their aging curves. Velocity and K rate for pitchers actually does fall off a cliff in the early to mid 30's. Power for hitters doesnt decline the same but a lot of other skills, ie speed, defense, bat speed etc and you see drops of 2-3 WAR over a 2-3 year period in mid 30's. I can agree not everyone is 34 on the dot but its not what most people want in the game..
                    It has nothing to do with if its natural or real life to me or not. It also has nothing to do with how much they are regressing. The problem I have is that it seems pre-determined what age a player will regress in the game and it looks to me like every player has a set age for when they will start their regression no matter the conditions and will always regress at the same pace. I know from memory Davis and Weiters last a long time I think... I usually trade Jones for Trout and he starts regression before them if I remember correct. I quit playing franchise because sometimes I would save when I started day one and sim 10 years and see who fell off and do it 10 times and realize the same guys are falling off at the same age every time. There are some guys who improve when they are over 30 too no matter what they can be doing horrible but they will improve I know last year Delmon Young was like that... obviously I use the orioles.
                    Last edited by thescottyglasgow; 05-21-2015, 10:34 PM.

                    Comment

                    • braves_94
                      Rookie
                      • Jul 2013
                      • 275

                      #11
                      Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                      Originally posted by ajblithe20
                      I'm not sure I agree with you point, but just to add to it... Ryan Howard did suffer a torn achilles in his final at bat of the 2011 season. So he missed some time in 2012 and had knee problems after that as well. So you can count Howard's sudden regression as having at least something to do with injuries
                      Examples... because I truly want to see the other side of the argument. For everyone you name I'm willing to bet I can name 4 who declines were natural. The closest I can think of are one year wonders like Brady Anderson. The Dale Murphy's of the world are rare, and I have an embarrassing amount of knowledge over past players since 90s.

                      Comment

                      • MLB Bob
                        MVP
                        • Jan 2011
                        • 1008

                        #12
                        Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                        so are you more concerned with overall ratings declining or players actual stats? because I see no mention of what the stats are after the decline and what it looks like leading up to the sharp decline.

                        Comment

                        • CSilver355
                          Rookie
                          • Apr 2015
                          • 18

                          #13
                          Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                          Originally posted by thescottyglasgow
                          It has nothing to do with if its natural or real life to me or not. It also has nothing to do with how much they are regressing. The problem I have is that it seems pre-determined what age a player will regress in the game and it looks to me like every player has a set age for when they will start their regression no matter the conditions and will always regress at the same pace. I know from memory Davis and Weiters last a long time I think... I usually trade Jones for Trout and he starts regression before them if I remember correct. I quit playing franchise because sometimes I would save when I started day one and sim 10 years and see who fell off and do it 10 times and realize the same guys are falling off at the same age every time. There are some guys who improve when they are over 30 too no matter what they can be doing horrible but they will improve I know last year Delmon Young was like that... obviously I use the orioles.
                          Literally took the words out of my mouth! It just seems pre-determined. I swear the guys at SCEA just hating on Trout making him become a crappy player after 28 lol. It just seems like the guys over at SCEA pre-determined which players were going to decline because as you stated NO MATTER WHAT the same players always end up declining ridiculously as far as overall ratings/attributes go. You could probably see the same thing happen with every single roster out too. OSFM is the roster I use. I have never tried simming with other rosters to see if the decline would be the same.

                          Comment

                          • thescottyglasgow
                            Rookie
                            • Mar 2013
                            • 175

                            #14
                            Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                            Originally posted by MLB Bob
                            so are you more concerned with overall ratings declining or players actual stats? because I see no mention of what the stats are after the decline and what it looks like leading up to the sharp decline.

                            I dont know if your talking to me or not sorry. What I am saying the numbers the stats none of it matter to me throw it all out. If i start my franchise and sim ahead no matter the circumstances I think the same guys will decline at the same age no matter what at the same rate. I dont care what the rate is or when it happens it just ruins it all for me when it feels like everything was predetermined day one of the franchise.

                            Comment

                            • MLB Bob
                              MVP
                              • Jan 2011
                              • 1008

                              #15
                              Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                              Originally posted by CSilver355
                              Literally took the words out of my mouth! It just seems pre-determined. I swear the guys at SCEA just hating on Trout making him become a crappy player after 28 lol. It just seems like the guys over at SCEA pre-determined which players were going to decline because as you stated NO MATTER WHAT the same players always end up declining ridiculously as far as overall ratings/attributes go. You could probably see the same thing happen with every single roster out too. OSFM is the roster I use. I have never tried simming with other rosters to see if the decline would be the same.
                              so is trout going from 50 hrs .315 avg and .400 OBP to 5 hrs/.205 avg and .245 OBP with his sudden decline? Is he retiring early due to skill or is it that his overall is lower?

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