Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

[charter04]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

So by assumption from what this tweet says, the game operates differently in user-user games than user-CPU games? Odd, to say the least.

He didn't say user v user. He just said user. That imply's it's any user game. Vs the CPU or user. Because the guy was wondering why you can't upgrade it. The answer was it's pointless to upgrade a rating for something that you don't use in a played game.

[Hooe]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

That wouldn't really make sense because in Madden 25's CFM mode the only stats for O-linemen that you can upgrade with XP points are their RBK, PBK, and IBK. There is no mechanism in place to upgrade their run-block-footwork or run-block-strength, etc. Why those stats are still in the game is far more confusing when they don't even show up on the standard player stats roster screen for CFM mode is far, FAR more confusing than implementing a functional system that takes into account each player's height and weight in the proper scenarios.

Already clarified about CFM in a post before yours.

Taking into account height and weight would be fine, sure, but again it misses my original point of how much height and weight matter vs the discrete ratings which are supposed to already tell me how that player performs.

Speaking with my game design hat on, "enough" isn't an adequate descriptor for determining how much strength vs weight should matter. Where's the line? What if I have a 180 lb player with 99 STR and a 330 lb player with 70 STR crashing into each other, who wins and by how much? How much does weight matter vs how much does STR matter?

It's fine to say all these ideals, but you have to get down to the nitty-gritty and explain how each detail applies and how much for it to make sense to do.

[Robrain]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

So by assumption from what this tweet says, the game operates differently in user-user games than user-CPU games? Odd, to say the least.

Seems to me that he implied that those ratings are used in neither user-vs-CPU nor user-vs-user. He seemed to be saying that they are only used in CPU-vs-CPU games currently, meaning simulating games in CFM mode.

[charter04]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

Seems to me that he implied that those ratings are used in neither user-vs-CPU nor user-vs-user. He seemed to be saying that they are only used in CPU-vs-CPU games currently, meaning simulating games in CFM mode.

I even doubt they do anything in those games. Since they can't be upgraded

[Robrain]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

Already clarified about CFM in a post before yours.

Taking into account height and weight would be fine, sure, but again it misses my original point of how much height and weight matter vs the discrete ratings which are supposed to already tell me how that player performs.

Speaking with my game design hat on, "enough" isn't an adequate descriptor for determining how much strength vs weight should matter. Where's the line? What if I have a 180 lb player with 99 STR and a 330 lb player with 70 STR crashing into each other, who wins and by how much? How much does weight matter vs how much does STR matter?

It's fine to say all these ideals, but you have to get down to the nitty-gritty and explain how each detail applies and how much for it to make sense to do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum

Application to collisions

Elastic collision of equal masses:


Elastic collision of unequal masses:

[Hooe]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum

I appreciate you completely dodging my question. I know what momentum and physics are, that's not sufficient to address the problem I described.

[Robrain]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

I appreciate you completely dodging my question. I know what momentum and physics are, that's not sufficient to address the problem I described.

My answer is dead simple: it's not the job of the people in these forums to program the game for the developers.

As a gamer, I EXPECT a company that's generated over $4 billion in Madden revenue:

http://money.cnn.com/2013/09/05/technology/innovation/madden-25/

To be able to hire programmers that are good at math and are paid to figure those equations out and get the numbers right.

Because it's not like physics is this ultra-mysterious class of mathematics at this point in history. Not at the relative scale that would need to be implemented to create a football game.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

Man this thread is full of frustration and disappointment, in relation to Madden. I wonder who comes up with some of the stuff at Tiburon, namely the User control being at odds with the influence of ratings. It's ironic that a game that's constantly being explained to be so convoluted and complicated at the coding level also seems so archaic. For example, dline/online being linked, wr/db/ball linked, defenders/ball carrier linked, ratings that are just numbers vs numbers for win/loss, etc.

The discussion about foot work is just a shame, imo, considering that blocking foot work actual exists and matters in real football and it seems they could mo cap different tiers/skill levels of it, to tie to ratings.

Gotmadskillzson has been pointing things like this out for years. http://www.operationsports.com/forum...hand-hand.html

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

I thought this was already pretty well known, that the ratings drive everything and that height / weight are purely cosmetic. I suppose not...?

Which to me makes some sense. Why should a 300-lb player with 99 STR be stronger than a 200-lb player with 99 STR? They both have 99 STR, that should mean the same thing across all players. If the 300-lb player should be stronger, how much stronger? It just strikes me as a unwieldy game balancing can of worms best left closed.

Maybe I am not getting your point, but a 200lb guy with 90 strength would have a more dificult time dealing with a 300lb guy with 90 strength...CAuse the 200/b guy has to deal with an extra 100 lbs.

What needs to be done, if weight and height are not a factor than, even if 300lb player benches the same reps as a 200lb player - to represent the difference in weight, the 200lb player should be rated maybe an 80 str and the 300 lb player rated a 90 str....This, at this point in time, seems to be the only way to represent weight difference....else why would I not just have my 90 Str 200 lb guy run block? cause of other ratings? maybe if I adjust my sliders so blocking is better, but I think we all know, ratings really don't matter, it is sliders and game difficulty that matter, such as All-Pro or All-Madden....

It is a joke...don't even look at ratings, just adjust sliders and move on...

[bucky60]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

Already clarified about CFM in a post before yours.

Taking into account height and weight would be fine, sure, but again it misses my original point of how much height and weight matter vs the discrete ratings which are supposed to already tell me how that player performs.

Speaking with my game design hat on, "enough" isn't an adequate descriptor for determining how much strength vs weight should matter. Where's the line?

How about using the real world as an example? A little statistical analysis on players bench press and weight in the real world and do some analysis and quantify the effect from real NFL games to come up with an model equation. We have all kinds of NFL games go draw from.

[hanzsomehanz]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

My answer is dead simple: it's not the job of the people in these forums to program the game for the developers.

As a gamer, I EXPECT a company that's generated over $4 billion in Madden revenue:

http://money.cnn.com/2013/09/05/technology/innovation/madden-25/

To be able to hire programmers that are good at math and are paid to figure those equations out and get the numbers right.

This is where I rest my case.

The previous gameplay designer, Victor Lugo, was also lead of the Infinity Enginr and his interviee blogs and videos would speak on these matters.

That was M13, the I.E was never mentioned again in M25 or M15 as we see it now. I appreciated Vic's education and expert speak on the subject of physics albeit things did not line up as he implied.

I no longer take their word for credence: I just let the product reveal itself. We can argue till we dry in the mouth and our lips turn purple. Reality is: their direction in the studio seldom aligns w a hardcore gamer's expectations.

If only Vic was able to carry out his plans to the peak of their physics engine potential.. alas he is gone now but when he was there his blog revealed the depth of knowledgable members on the team.



Sent from my SGH-I727R using Tapatalk

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

Franchise play interview with Donnie Moore.

<iframe src="//www.youtube.com/embed/CxdH4vw_kpM?rel=0" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

I hate it - people get a chance to interview these people and then go soft on the questions...Crappy interview and interviewer......

Get on them about how ratings don't matter, how sliders work or don't work...Why they rate so high? Why they will not take the ratings from a place like FBGamers? Why not implement a mass ratings editor in the game? Why not explain how sliders work, interact and generally effect game, including penalty sliders...


This whole interview was a waste of time to make and listen to...


*** Also, so strength and then a little Pass Block and Run Block are involved in netermining how long a block is held? Yeah, maybe; until you as the RB hit the boost/accelerate button, then every defender breaks their block at the same time.....another madden joke...

[Khanchus]

I agree with most of you with the phyiscal and technical attributes

some of the ratings are way to high such as the 94rbk for robinson

but some are fairly accurate



someone mentioned before at least we don't have a 87 Reggie bush

disappointed CJ Mosley didn't make the cut but being a ravens fan makes me biased so i cant argue with that

[Matt Diesel]

Blake Bortles!? He is a project to begin with.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Madden NFL 15: Top Rookies

How about using the real world as an example? A little statistical analysis on players bench press and weight in the real world and do some analysis and quantify the effect from real NFL games to come up with an model equation. We have all kinds of NFL games go draw from.

That's part of why I think displaying the numeric ratings is unnecessary because they should just be calculations that are modified under the hood for given situations. I won't go too much into this because I'll just frustrate myself but the notion of displaying a static x rating seems pointless. I don't know how well it works but the guy making Dynasty Football claims to calculate physics, I don't really understand why Madden can't do something similar under the hood.

OS: Your game is physics based correct? Explain that a little bit. How does this directly effect gameplay?

EK: Instead of using statistics to generate play results I have used physics formulas integrated with player's attributes. I worked with my retired electrical engineer father on these equations, using things like player vectors, collisions, and intercept paths. I'm not exaggerating when I state that this is all from Isaac Newton laws; Dynasty Football could not exist without that guy's genius (and my old man's as well!) http://www.operationsports.com/featu...eric-kneipfer/

Now I'm not saying that a text based sim is the same thing as playing Madden, what I'm asking is why can't Madden use something similar under the hood to calculate its' outcomes. Couldn't this same concept be used to make physics, namely weight, height/leverage, relevant in Madden or is it not as simple as it seems, for whatever reason?