Ongoing pro/college basketball thread (2023-24)

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I really, really wish SGA could go back in time and play against the 80's Pistons or 76ers. Watching him push off, arm hook, and head butt defenders and get foul calls is so infuriating to watch.

No, a lot of those games were bullshit displays of ridiculous fouling.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

No disrespect but no you don't.

IMO, this was the one way the players were allowed to police themselves and place a cost on foul seeking. Unfortunately, we all clutch our pearls and removed it from the game because allowing the players to police themselves was not a good product to watch.

Sorry if that came off as too harsh. Funny enough, there is a sort of irony in me apologizing. I am particularly sensitive to the foul seeking/chasing conversation today. I was listening to a podcast where the commentators were suggesting the Pacers needed to "be more physical" with the Thunder and not allow them to run their offense so easily. Then, the commentators immediately covered their asses by saying they weren't saying the Pacers should try and hurt the Thunder and they should be more aggressive within the rules and much more verbal diarrhea after that in order to walk back the talk of being more physical. In other words, be more physical without touching them too hard.

I’m not listening to podcasts or talking heads. I’ve just been watching the games because my son has gotten into it. And, it is abysmal to watch with the style of play they have.

You’d be hard pressed to find two teams that I am less interested in that these two, but after watching SGA’s bullshit push offs and arm hooks. And seeing him lay on the ground for 30 seconds every time a foul is called and throw his hands up in frustration nearly every time he drives, whether he makes it or not, I would absolutely love to see a Mahorn or Oakley put 5 or 6 fouls on him a game over the course of a series. He’s a ridiculously skilled, outstanding player, but the approach and body language is awful to watch. Last night, while on his pivot foot with ball he headbutted a stationary defender in the chest and then the shoulder and got a foul call 5 ft behind the 3 point line. If he’s not going to get laid out, hopefully the refs start calling fouls on the contact he initiates and technicals on his pissy body language.

I’m now a fan of the Pacers. I love how they run and hustle and push in offense the entire game. I quit watching the NBA years ago, because it wasn’t worth it to watch a full game when they just screw around and play one on one for the first three quarters, but watching the style the Pacers, Celtics, and Nuggets play has made me a fan again.

[flere-imsaho]

In an ideal world I'd prefer a middle ground between the BS calls SGA gets and the BS fouls the Pistons got away with, but if I had to choose only between the two I'd pick the former. It was absolutely no fun watching the Pistons literally assault and batter their way through games, neutering talent and enjoyment of the game in pursuit of primarily, it seemed, resolving their own personal mental and emotional issues and secondarily winning games.

[dubb93]

All time one sided officiated half so far.

[dubb93]

Minutes later the refs give another free possession to OKC and then call a shooting foul on it.

[dubb93]

Just brutal. Three more to OKC on the missed charge.

[dubb93]

Pacers finally get some free throws and don’t hit them.

Game can still go either way.

[JonInMiddleGA]

And yet with 2 mins left, there's a 2 FTA difference in the teams and OKC has one MORE foul against them.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

And yet with 2 mins left, there's a 2 FTA difference in the teams and OKC has one MORE foul against them.

The team playing worse will probably foul more. What did the first half free throws look like? When I posted about them OKC was up 17-10. OKC had a terrible first half and the refs bailed them out. Mathurin had a spectacularly bad last two minutes.

[RainMaker]

Feels like those free throw misses in the 3rd quarter really crushed them. They had a chance to really pull away and let OKC hang around.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by dubb93

The team playing worse will probably foul more. What did the first half free throws look like? When I posted about them OKC was up 17-10. OKC had a terrible first half and the refs bailed them out. Mathurin had a spectacularly bad last two minutes.

Here is the raw data that I charted during the game. Insert context as needed.

1st Qtr- IND had 5 fouls called against them resulting in OKC going 9/9 FTs, OKC had 5 fouls called against them resulting in IND going 9/10 FTs

2nd Qtr- IND had 5 fouls called against (1 Flagrant) OKC went 7/8 FTs, OKC 5 fouls called against them (1 Flagrant, 1 offensive) IND 2/3 FTs

3rd Qtr- IND 7 fouls called against (1 offensive) resulting in OKC going 5/6 FTs, OKC 7 fouls called against(1 offensive) 7/10 FTs for IND.

4th Qtr- IND 10 fouls called against 12/15 FTs for OKC, OKC 9 fouls called against resulting in 6/10 FTs for IND.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Here is the raw data that I charted during the game. Insert context as needed.

1st Qtr- IND had 5 fouls called against them resulting in OKC going 9/9 FTs, OKC had 5 fouls called against them resulting in IND going 9/10 FTs

2nd Qtr- IND had 5 fouls called against (1 Flagrant) OKC went 7/8 FTs, OKC 5 fouls called against them (1 Flagrant, 1 offensive) IND 2/3 FTs

3rd Qtr- IND 7 fouls called against (1 offensive) resulting in OKC going 5/6 FTs, OKC 7 fouls called against(1 offensive) 7/10 FTs for IND.

4th Qtr- IND 10 fouls called against 12/15 FTs for OKC, OKC 9 fouls called against resulting in 6/10 FTs for IND.

So by end of quarters
5-5 fouls
10-10 fouls
17-17 fouls
27 Indy fouls, 26 OKC fouls ... and based on the pbp, looks like the last three Indy fouls were intentionals, so through 47+ minutes, it was 26-24 OKC

For the game, OKC shot 5 more free throws ... but the last four of those were in the intentional foul minute.

[dubb93]

The second half didn’t have many issues in officiating (minus that SGA push off travel) but the first half was egregious.

You had several “fouls” that the announcers and video pointed out were not actually fouls including a charge that put points on the board for OKC that shouldn’t have been there and the Caruso turnover that they somehow called wrong and ended up leading to 3 for OKC. You could even argue that flagrant (as the announce crew did) on OKC should have been a technical since the foul wasn’t on the guy that got the flagrant and should have sent a better free throw shooter to the line than it did.

When they pointed out at the half that OKC was only down three but it felt like alot more, the reason for that was all of the above.

[RainMaker]

I dont understand why there is no game tomorrow.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I dont understand why there is no game tomorrow.

Game 3/4 are the only time in the Finals that had less than two off days between.

Seems to be in order to avoid Saturday (which they also did last year)

[JonInMiddleGA]

I saw the Memphis/Orlando trade on Twitter and 99.99% thought it was one of those fake sports trade deals, you know, where somebody is trolling.

I know I'm not an NBA guy or anything but 4 firsts (and other stuff) for a guy that I couldn't have named if you asked me to name 100 players in the league today just kinda feels like a little much.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I saw the Memphis/Orlando trade on Twitter and 99.99% thought it was one of those fake sports trade deals, you know, where somebody is trolling.

I know I'm not an NBA guy or anything but 4 firsts (and other stuff) for a guy that I couldn't have named if you asked me to name 100 players in the league today just kinda feels like a little much.

Kind of my feeling too but it always seems like NBA teams don’t value these picks anyways as most of the guys just take up roster spaces. It seems like Orlando feels like they are entering their window and don’t feel like mid to late first round picks are going to help them for the next 4 years. I haven’t looked at their roster and contracts but they may also just not have room for these guys on their roster. That happenes sometimes too.

Looks like they needed outside shooting (Magic shot the worst mark in the league from 3) and Bane is a 40% shooter from downtown. Someone in the front office has decided that improving that will get them over the hump.

[Danny]

Bane is a very good player. Like dubb said, late first rounders just arent that valuable and the current nba leaves open for teams to contend even if you arent a super team. You see a team like Indiana have a solid chance to win the chip with 0 traditional superstars.

[Atocep]

I think it's a good trade for both sides. The magic desperately needed outside shooting and Bane has the added bonus of being a good defender and a solid playmaker. One of the more underrated players in the game. There aren't many 20/5/5 guys on 47/40/88 career percentages with the added bonus of only being 26. The East is also potentially pretty open next year.

For the Grizz, this gives them a soft reset on a roster that seemed to be maxed out and the picks to swing a big trade at some point if someone becomes available.

[dubb93]

The Magic already have their “superstars” in Wagner and Banchero averaging 25 and 24 ppg at 23 and 22. If those two continue to develop adding a good guard, which they don’t really have, could be a home run.

EDIT: The Magic ended the season with Cory Joseph and Kentavious Caldwell-Pope starting at the two guard spots.

[HerRealName]

I turned the game off last night when they called the foul during the jump ball.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by HerRealName

I turned the game off last night when they called the foul during the jump ball.

Was only able to watch the 2nd quarter so I don’t have much thought on the entire game other than the Pacers can’t win when Halliburton’s stat line is that bed. You can’t call out the media for saying you aren’t a superstar and then not hit a single shot in this situation.

[Ksyrup]

Haliburton is hurt. But he's also disappeared for a game or two in the other series, as well. Hard to know what's happening.

My daughter told me that someone quoted Doris Burke as saying that SGA doesn't push off, he just "releases contact." WTF does that mean?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Haliburton is hurt. But he's also disappeared for a game or two in the other series, as well. Hard to know what's happening.

He's hurt but holy hell the OKC defense is insanely good.

[RainMaker]

Lakers sell for $10 billion! What great timing for the league to have a young start entering his prime get traded to that team right before the sale was made!

[Atocep]

The draft is next week. Some thoughts and things I've seen/read:

Kevin Pelton's projection system has Flagg as the 3rd best prospect his system has rated going into the draft behind Zion and Luka. Zero statistical weaknesses

Ace Bailey either as a promise from a team he likes outside the top 5 or he's just organically having the worst predraft process in recent memory. His team and media interviews have been a disaster and he's been refusing and/or canceling individual workouts with teams that he wouldn't be the focal point on immediately.

If the Sixers stay at 3 I think the pick is Edgecombe or Knueppel. Edgecombe is less of a fit but has elite defensive potential.

Derik Queen feels like a 90s big that teams are going to convince themselves can play at a high level in today's NBA despite the lack of athleticism, defense, and inability to finish at the rim.

I really like Cedric Coward as a guy that can step right in and do a lot of things to help you win without being a star.

I think Knueppel would fit with the Spurs far better than Harper, but it's going to be really difficult/impossible to pass him at 2.