Should be fun to revisit.

at least 4 - injuries, age, and bad luck will cost them some years.

The supporting cast/bench for that team will be horrid. They are going to be vulnerable for sure.

I wonder if any sports figure has gone from so admired to so vilified in an instant?

It's like Blue Chips

The supporting cast/bench for that team will be horrid. They are going to be vulnerable for sure.

Winner.

I don't think the surrounding roster will be as bad as people think. There are some players who are going to sacrifice and play for the minimum for a chance to win with this trio.

Maybe some 2 million $ players or aging guys who have already made a ton of cash, but there is no way anyone is going to turn down 5 million for the minimum.

I voted with my heart. :)

I don't think the surrounding roster will be as bad as people think. There are some players who are going to sacrifice and play for the minimum for a chance to win with this trio.

Is James, Wade, Bosh, 1 decent player, and a bunch of filler better than the Lakers or a handful of other teams? I'd say Kobe and Gasol by themselves are a match for James and Wade and the Lakers are much deeper.

If winning a championship, in any sport, was so simply reduced to pairing a few superstars, it would be a lot easier to predict champions, and to build one. I think people are overestimating the advantage this will give Miami. It's still a lot of luck and a lot of other factors that have to come into play to win.

If winning a championship, in any sport, was so simply reduced to pairing a few superstars, it would be a lot easier to predict champions, and to build one. I think people are overestimating the advantage this will give Miami. It's still a lot of luck and a lot of other factors that have to come into play to win.

Superstars in basketball have more effect than any other sport.

I think 1, but I was very torn between 1 and 0. I think they'll get one but it won't be this year. You can't just put 3 superstars with a team full of filler level talent and expect them to win. At least I don't think you can - it will be fun to find out.

Superstars in basketball have more effect than any other sport.

Surely adding one player on a 5 person team is going to make a bigger difference than adding a football player, etc, etc. But it's still no guarantee of a title.

Ill give them 2 athough it will take them 3 years to win the first. They will need to develop another piece before they will be able to win it.

Read The Book of Basketball - you don't build a championship team this way.

I say at least two in five years but I think once they win the first one they will continue to win until one of them stops being a top level player.

Ill give them 2 athough it will take them 3 years to win the first. They will need to develop another piece before they will be able to win it.

No way does this team stay together if they go two years without winning a ring.

Read The Book of Basketball - you don't build a championship team this way.

I've never read that book but from my experience this trio can win a title. That being said a strong supporting cast would make them deadly and impossible to beat.

They still need an asshole.

I say 2. They win one next year and then miss a year, then win another, then don't win, then something happens and it's done.

If they don't win a title within three years I'll laugh. I think I'll cheer against this team more than the Shaq/Kobe Lakers.

Read The Book of Basketball - you don't build a championship team this way.

Who becomes the alpha dog on that team? Wade or Lebron? The other guy has to play second banana.

Who becomes the alpha dog on that team? Wade or Lebron? The other guy has to play second banana.

Maybe the way this all went down was a statement for that? Bosh/Wade as the second bananas and King LeBron as the big star?

I say two probably three.

Is James, Wade, Bosh, 1 decent player, and a bunch of filler better than the Lakers or a handful of other teams? I'd say Kobe and Gasol by themselves are a match for James and Wade and the Lakers are much deeper.

Not sure about Gasol being a wash with either Wade or James more likely Bosh. Kobe and James maybe even but still leaves another superstar. The Lakers got Jackson as coach, team chemistry and a decent set of role players but about even with those two teams. I think it would once again come down to B ynum being healthy like always.

My gut says this will either go very, very well or very, very badly. Either these guys jell together and they run off 4-5 titles or the whole thing blows up and no one is speaking to each other by next May.

However, middle ground is always more likely. I'd really like the Lakers to take them down next year just to prove that you can't buy a title. But we know differently -- Celtics did it in 2008. This is very similar to the situation although Lebron is better than Pierce and Wade is better than Allen (I think Garnett is better than Bosh though). I think they'll win a title but not sure this will work long term -- probably win in the next two years, then struggle.

Sure, the Celtics did it in 2008, but they also had James Posey, Kendrick Perkins, Rajon Rondo, Eddie House, and PJ Brown. Who will the Heat get that can match that?

If one gets hurt they are done. They are all going to have to play 40+ minutes to win and they won't stay healthy doing that.

My gut says this will either go very, very well or very, very badly. Either these guys jell together and they run off 4-5 titles or the whole thing blows up and no one is speaking to each other by next May.

However, middle ground is always more likely. I'd really like the Lakers to take them down next year just to prove that you can't buy a title. But we know differently -- Celtics did it in 2008. This is very similar to the situation although Lebron is better than Pierce and Wade is better than Allen (I think Garnett is better than Bosh though). I think they'll win a title but not sure this will work long term -- probably win in the next two years, then struggle.

This is a completely different situation then the Celtics. They had a very good supporting cast.

I think it will possible for them to find a good enough supporting cast. This is an incredible opportunity for fringe guys who will barely be covered by anyone. There will be many open shots.

This is a completely different situation then the Celtics. They had a very good supporting cast.

But at the time of the initial big three, weren't there big question marks about the supporting cast? Or did people think Perkins, etc. were gonna be decent?

But at the time of the initial big three, weren't there big question marks about the supporting cast? Or did people think Perkins, etc. were gonna be decent?

The Celtics brought in Sam Cassell and Stephon Marbury in recent years -which tells you how much faith they had in Rondo.

And yes, there were definitely concerns that the C's had nothing beyond the big three. Weren't Garnett, Peirce, and Allen all max or close to max guys?

But at the time of the initial big three, weren't there big question marks about the supporting cast? Or did people think Perkins, etc. were gonna be decent?

Maybe not on Perkins and Rondo, but people did sit up and take notice when the Celtics got James Posey and Eddie House.

I'll say one just because Chris Paul will join them in a few years making them the big 4.

I'll say one just because Chris Paul will join them in a few years making them the big 4.

I don't even see how that would be possible.

Don't think he was that admired. He's hyped to the max but he's already been vilified more than most stars. He just cemented himself as a POS who is going to have a nearly impossible job of digging out of this decision.

Number 2 selling jersey in the NBA.

I'll go 1. LeBron really has a ceiling of about 5, according to Simmons. I tend to agree with that. I don't think Bosh will last 5 years either. At some point the super friends will have a falling out.

One of the big three won't be on the team in March 2012.

They'll have a fun summer, play some ball, dunk a lot for the cameras, pull off some amazing highlights. They'll feed off of each other's energy. But they aren't going to work their butts off as much as they need to, and they're going to start second-guessing themselves the moment some disciplined team shows up and embarasses them. I'm thinking Jerry Sloan or Gregg Popovich or someone is going to see something in the Heat's game one night and just blow them up. Then they start thinking too much, and they have Phoenix the next night, and Steve Nash just goes lights out and turns it on. Doesn't have to happen every night; it just has to happen once. Then they get the Lakers at the end of a road trip and can't deal with a deep bench and front line talent that compares to theirs, and suddenly you've got a losing streak. Now all the buddy-buddy cameraderie really gets tested, and that team is just going to come apart. Then at least one of them will get hurt, miss a chunk of the playoffs, and they get bounced. By next fall, everyone's wondering "what happened", the fun and games are over, and what looked like a great idea a year ago is no longer a slam dunk. One of them will be gone by trading deadline, year 2.

Outside of the lack of depth, the Achilles heel could still be Chris Bosh IMO. As I said in the other thread, I'm not at all sure he is well suited for the role that he will have to play on this team.

None.

They win a plethora of games the next two years. They sweep the Lakers for the second time in as many years. Kobe Bryant has a hissy fit and launches a nuclear weapon at Miami. That's how the world ends.

How do so many people have 0 selected? If they don't win at least 3, it's a massive failure. They have maybe the two best guys in the league and another All-Star entering their prime.

Superstars in basketball have more effect than any other sport.

Even more than tennis or boxing????

Zero. None. Zilch. they barely won the gold with Kobe. The Bulls and Magic are going to be in the Eastern Conference Finals for the next 5 years.

After reading Cleveland owner Dan Gilberts letter, Im inclined to change my vote to zero. He just put a curse on any city LeBron plays for.

I just don't see them getting past the Bucks in any given year.

Too many egos to massage, and no Phil Jackson to tend said egos.

With only one basketball to go around, this "team" implodes on itself.

These guys are going to keep their egos in check long enough to win a championship? Doubtful. The best bet to win one will be in the first year when they might be super-motivated to do so. And if they don't win next year there's going to be a lot of finger-pointing. A lot.

Plus, every team will be gunning for them every game. Over the season that's going to take its toll. Wade won't play 82 which means that you'll have Bosh, LeBron and the three Slugs on the court for x number of games. And there likely will be a lot of pressure to win more than 72 which may mean that the big Three may play mucho minutes. Will they have anything left come playoff time? All I know is that they are such "clutch" championship-caliber players that they have one ring between them. I wouldn't put your money down just yet guys...

You think next year they have a chance with the three stars playing 40+ minutes a game and some combination of Bosh and scrub center to be named later trying to guard Dwight Howard? What happens to this team if Bosh gets in foul trouble? You think Lebron and Wade are good enough to negate the fact that you don't have a single player who isn't minimum salary in the frontcourt then?

When you think about it, they are only going to be able to add one MLE player every year as well (as well as the LLE but those typically aren't much better than minsal). It's not like in years 3 and 4 this team is going to be flush with bench talent. The whole argument is - do you think 3 superstars (2 of whom are very similar and the other is a big man who would rather not be a big man) are going to be that dominant that they win multiple NBA titles? I just don't see dynasty.

How do so many people have 0 selected? If they don't win at least 3, it's a massive failure. They have maybe the two best guys in the league and another All-Star entering their prime.

Where are the other 25-30 points a game coming from?

Where are the other 25-30 points a game coming from?

From a ton of wide open three-pointers

Even more than tennis or boxing????

I should have said any team sport ;)

... - it will be fun to find out.


No, actually, it won't. We'll hear nothing but "Superteam fails again, or Superteam wins again" every fucking day of the season until they get knocked out of the playoffs. it won't be fun at all listening to the same idiotic drivel that went on for the last 3 weeks.

Saddest part is Lebron has now destroyed 2 franchises and his own legacy instead of being a hero while failing to get one to a title.

So tired of hearing about this asshole.

After reading Cleveland owner Dan Gilberts letter, Im inclined to change my vote to zero. He just put a curse on any city LeBron plays for.You can tell by the font that he's serious, too.

"I PERSONALLY GUARANTEE THAT THE CLEVELAND CAVALIERS WILL WIN AN NBA CHAMPIONSHIP BEFORE THE SELF-TITLED FORMER ‘KING’ WINS ONE"

yeah, Comic Sans is a poor choice for bold proclamations.

They will need to get lucky on min FAs, draft decent and avoid injuries. But, they have the most difficult piece in place (3 top stars). So, I think they could win 3 if everything breaks right.

I'd rather be Miami and be looking for solid role players at center and guard instead of New York looking for 2 more impact players (but having a lot of mediocre role players).

Depends on the quality of players willing to take the minimum to play for them in the first two years. After that at least they start getting some MLE and 1st round picks to build their depth.

Nice thing is that I guess they don't really need a traditional point guards on this team, but more of Steve Kerr spot up shooters at point which should be easy to find cheap.

I think a lot of people are putting too much into the lack of role players.

You have to remember a few things:

1) You are going to have the ring chasers. They'll be traded mid year, bought out and brought in by the Heat on a one year min deal to win one with the Heat.

2) They only need to look for very specific skill sets in finding other players. They need a PG who can hit a three and play decent defense. They need a physical center who can play D and rebound. Over the next couple of years, they'll get those things in place with the MLE and through the draft.

3) All of the players average over 36 minutes a night. With the proper rotations, they are going to have at least two of the three on the floor for all but a couple of minutes a night.

I hope to God they never win a thing. I won't cheer for an injury, but I'll be cheering against this team in a big way. That said, they are winning a title. Probably multiple titles by the time this is said and done. They are 25/26/28 and are locked into playing together for 5 years. It would take Sterling to buy the team for them not to grab at least one ring with those parameters.

I voted zero titles. The Cleveland owner put a curse on Lebron. So, it's over, done deal...no titles.

I'd rather be Miami and be looking for solid role players at center and guard instead of New York looking for 2 more impact players (but having a lot of mediocre role players).

That's a really good way to put it. There's a plenty of limited, fringe guys out there who can do one or two things well. And if they pick the wrong one - they can get rid of him and get another one.

I voted zero titles. The Cleveland owner put a curse on Lebron. So, it's over, done deal...no titles.

Don't forget about the personal guarantee.

Don't forget about the personal guarantee.

Oh yea!!

This is a typical case of trying to buy a championship. Only difference between this and the Yankees is the Heat can't overpay at the other two positions.

The other thing, James could have won a title in Cleveland. Yes, they needed a #2 guy, but I think the chemistry of a team with a clear #1, #2, and #3 option is much better than options 1A, 1B, and 2.

They are willing to go way over the Cap, right ? Resign some of their own FA instead of going for minimum guys exclusively, right ?
That´s sth that (strangely) isn´t being talked about so much. The suporting cast wasn´t downright terrible last year at the least, even when considering that O´Neal is gone.

Haslem and Richardson are solid guys to have for 15-20 minutes a night, you could do worse for your 7th and 8th guy.
Dorrell Wright also isn´t half bad and added a shockingly reliable 3 point shot out of nothing last year that might still improve.

One guy from the draft i think will actually also help them is their 2nd round pick Varnado, Ben Wallace light on defense with sth resembling an offensive game doesn´t sound too bad in a limited role on that team.

So ultimately it would be sth like :

X/Varnado
Bosh/Haslem/Varnado
James/Miller/Richardson/Wright
Wade/Miller/Richardson/Wright
Chalmers/X

don´t think Arroyo will be back (at the very least i expect him to wait to see what type of contract here in Europe he can earn at the World Champioship in August), wouldn´t fit anyway as spot up shooting isn´t his thing.

the lack of a starting center is huge obviously, but Miller/Richardson/Wright really would be a pretty good backup rotation at the 2/3 imo and Haslem is also above average as far as backup PFs go.



Is James, Wade, Bosh, 1 decent player, and a bunch of filler better than the Lakers or a handful of other teams? I'd say Kobe and Gasol by themselves are a match for James and Wade and the Lakers are much deeper.

They actually aren´t. After Odom their bench is quickly going from bad to putrid ... Dividing it into "tiers" with no saying which team is better where :

James/Wade --- Kobe/Gasol
Odom/Bynum --- Bosh/Haslem (there´s little reason why you wouldn´t resign the guy)
Artest/Fisher --- Miller/Chalmers

Then the Lakers bench last year consisted of : Farmar, Vujacic, Mbenga, Brown, Powell, Walton.
That´s not earth shattering really and had the Lakers had an injury to anyone but Bynum from their starting 5 they would have been in real trouble.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/07/09/sports/CAVS/CAVS-popup.jpg

Where are the other 25-30 points a game coming from?
The wide open guys on the court. Riley convinced Lebron to be a ring-chaser, I'm sure he can convince a few vets looking for one too. Those 3 will make everyone on the court much better. Mike Miller won't have a soul within 5 feet of him at that 3-point arc all season.

The only way they don't win multiple titles is if the egos clash and they can't figure out a proper pecking order. Wade has been pretty passive though, and Bosh is just sucking dicks, so I don't know if that will even be an issue.

They are willing to go way over the Cap, right ? Resign some of their own FA instead of going for minimum guys exclusively, right ?


I thought they had to renounce their bird rights to get the cap space?

If a sign & trade with Cleveland goes through, it would give Miami room to bring back Richardson, Haslem, and Wright, plus a MLE.

Sorry, if they don't win the title next year, it's a failure on one of the biggest scales we've ever seen in the league. I'm sure we still have some excuses being readied for it though.

Right, but it wouldn't need to be their own guys - that would be cap space they could use on anyone. They can't go over the cap to bring back those guys any more because they renounced their rights to get the cap space in the first place. At least that's how I understand it.

Also MLE is out of the window as they weren't over the cap at the start of FA

Under the cap, over the cap.....Miami has always been over the cap. Once guys like ONeal signed, they got closer to being under. But Wade's hold is like 22m, guys like Richardson, Haslem....those guys count vs the cap. So they still have the MLE.

Now, once they start renouncing players to free space, they go under the cap.

I mean, people realize that LeBron James hasn't signed technically anywhere, and neither have Wade or Bosh?

Ah, so they didn't actually renounce any of those guys then? My bad. That's actually a very smart way to go about it, keep the MLE and if you don't make a splash in free agency you don't have to blow up the team.

In that case Whomario is absolutely correct, why is nobody talking about them bringing back those guys and why are they only offering Haslem a minsal deal?

If you look real closely, there is even something funnier about this picture.

http://imgur.com/nzdrY.jpg

So Lebron is an FOFCer, huh?

Ah, so they didn't actually renounce any of those guys then? My bad. That's actually a very smart way to go about it, keep the MLE and if you don't make a splash in free agency you don't have to blow up the team.

In that case Whomario is absolutely correct, why is nobody talking about them bringing back those guys and why are they only offering Haslem a minsal deal?

From what I understand - yes they had to renounce bird rights or they wouldn't have cap space to sign James & Bosh. So there is no MLE. It makes some sense if you think about it. You can't be over the cap, get the MLE, then magically renounce all your players to get to nearly 0 in cap and keep the MLE. Or maybe you can since the NBA cap is so ridiculous.

If someone like Miller signs for MLE dollars, it will be because James, Bosh, and Wade all take a little less.

0. Too many cooks in the kitchen. We'll see how long it takes for someone to start bitching about their shot selection.

i posted this in the NBA offseason thread, probably belongs here as well:

they simply don't have the bench/depth for rings. your starters have to rest at some point, and if they're logging heavy minutes during multiple playoff series its just not gonna work. would love to see what a Ron Artest could do to LBJ during a championship Finals. Artest made Pierce disappear. not out of spite or bias since i'm a NYK fan - but i honestly don't see this bunch going to more than 2 Finals and not winning any. i think Boston will knock them out next year (for one last hurrah of high calibrer play from KG, Pierce and Allen + better bench), Orlando will emerge as the powerhouse that becomes the East's Beast - and Heat/Orlando becomes the league's favorite must-see rivalry, and NYK may steal one series from MIA due to have the cap space to add more quality depth and add Carmelo to the roster, possibly CP3 if New Orleans is smart to take Eddie Curry's huge expiring contract for him to get out of the luxury tax threshhold. over the next 6 years i can see MIA going to the Finals twice. don't forget towards the end of that 6 year run Wade will be in his mid-30s and will have been banged up multiple times. he's not exactly the world's most resilient guard as he's shown over the years.

From what I understand - yes they had to renounce bird rights or they wouldn't have cap space to sign James & Bosh. So there is no MLE. It makes some sense if you think about it. You can't be over the cap, get the MLE, then magically renounce all your players to get to nearly 0 in cap and keep the MLE. Or maybe you can since the NBA cap is so ridiculous.

If someone like Miller signs for MLE dollars, it will be because James, Bosh, and Wade all take a little less.


Except they are doing sign and trades for James and Bosh so I don't think they renounced the bird rights.

49 people are about to be proved wrong

year to the day bump

Lol!

-58, 57, and and 66 wins (the middle season normalized to an 82-game schedule)
-2 championships and 1 other finals appearance.

I thought they'd be better in the regular season, but they've had some injuries, and of course the regular season doesn't really matter towards their real goals. So will LeBron opt out after next season? I'm feeling good about my prediction of 3.

I said 2 although that was mainly because I didn't see them staying this healthy. They should have 3 if they didn't choke so bad against Dallas. I think barring a major injury they are a lock to win again.

I think the best thing for LeBron's legacy would be if he went back to Cleveland and won there. It's be risky because he could fail there, and it would be a lot easier to keep the band together longer and win 5 or whatever in Miami.

I know I'll be classified as a LeBron hater (and I probably am) but Jordan never had a championship run this weak. The Heat played the same number of game sevens this year as the Bull did in six seasons. The Pacers had this team beat, and so did the Spurs. That was an ugly way to get their second.

A healthy Oklahoma City team or Memphis team next year will be a challenge, assuming the Heat make it back there. This run was ugly.

I think the best thing for LeBron's legacy would be if he went back to Cleveland and won there. It's be risky because he could fail there, and it would be a lot easier to keep the band together longer and win 5 or whatever in Miami.
Given how many people still hate him or think less of him because of The Decision, it's the only thing he could do to ever be considered as good as Jordan. He could win six titles in Miami and to a lot of people he'll still be the guy who couldn't get the job done in Cleveland and had to go find some help in Miami.

I know I'll be classified as a LeBron hater (and I probably am) but Jordan never had a championship run this weak. The Heat played the same number of game sevens this year as the Bull did in six seasons. The Pacers had this team beat, and so did the Spurs. That was an ugly way to get their second.

A healthy Oklahoma City team or Memphis team next year will be a challenge, assuming the Heat make it back there. This run was ugly.

I think a healthy Lakers team would make it interesting.

I think OKC gave up their shot when they dumped Harden to save money. Teams will put up a good fight and there might be a big upset, but Miami has way more talent than anyone in the league.

grats to the 19 people who said 2.

grats to the 19 people who said 2.

20.

Thank you!

Did someone seriously just edit this to remove the "zero" option? 4 years later?

Did someone seriously just edit this to remove the "zero" option? 4 years later?

Ha that's much worse than what I did.

FTR it was not I.

I was in the 2 group, though I believe I thought it would happen over a larger stretch of time, like 5-7 years or however long their deals were supposed to cover (didn't realise they could all opt-out the way it went down).

I voted 0 out of spite. :)

Wasn't around to vote on this but I'd have been in the 3, maybe 4, crowd. From looking at the first page, pretty sad to see Wade go from "entering his prime" and "will he be the top dog instead of LeBron?" to what he is 3-4 years after the fact. Hard to predict such a drastic fall-off.

On the other end of the spectrum, the Spurs at the time of the Decision had just been swept by Phoenix in the conference semis, and everyone was wondering whether Duncan was nearing the end of his rope. Sports! Pretty crazy, huh?

Wasn't around to vote on this but I'd have been in the 3, maybe 4, crowd. From looking at the first page, pretty sad to see Wade go from "entering his prime" and "will he be the top dog instead of LeBron?" to what he is 3-4 years after the fact. Hard to predict such a drastic fall-off.

On the other end of the spectrum, the Spurs at the time of the Decision had just been swept by Phoenix in the conference semis, and everyone was wondering whether Duncan was nearing the end of his rope. Sports! Pretty crazy, huh?

Thats why these threads are always fun to revisit