Ouch,

Greece (NBA-less players) sends the USA back to school :)

US lacked of a great PG and some shooters. They looked at the zone as a "monster".
Papaloukas and Spanoulis have beaten all the US pressure.

Hmmm. I'm disappointed, but I guess the fact that I didn't watch a single minute of any of the games means I'm not THAT disappointed.

Saying it before someone else does: Eurosnob alert!

I'm disappointed this didn't happen earlier.

Hmmm. I'm disappointed, but I guess the fact that I didn't watch a single minute of any of the games means I'm not THAT disappointed.

"

Hmmm. I'm disappointed, but I guess the fact that I didn't watch a single minute of any of the games means I'm not THAT disappointed.

I'll third this.

I'm not all that surprised, because the NBA has gotten about as far from play that will win in the international arena as possible. When basketball in the rest of the world catches up to us, and becomes all about flash and physical play, then we'll have them right where we want them.

What the USA team lacked was a reliable "shooter" and a god damn Center. It's not as if you did not have one.

And Spain beats Argentina. WoW. An all European final.

Greece (NBA-less players)

Bullshit...Spanoulis is a Rocket! :p

Too late alert. I'm a spaniard-snob! Spain and Argentina played a bad game with tons of heart.

I hope Gasol could play the final.

Should I stop watching the NBA now, considering it's obviously not the top level of basketball? This is like an All-Star NFL team losing to some other football team out there that contains only a couple of NFL players...

Once again they go into an international competition without any 3 point marksmen. So the loss is not suprising at all. Perhaps next year they will find some guys that can hit 40% from the international distance.

But I think a healthy Marion and a healthy Amare might make a difference the next time.

Should I stop watching the NBA now, considering it's obviously not the top level of basketball? This is like an All-Star NFL team losing to some other football team out there that contains only a couple of NFL players...

This is apples to oranges IMO. It would be like taking an NFL all star team, and making them play canadian football vs the rest of the world, who only play canadian football.

Didn't Arenas get injured, and wasn't he their main 3-point threat?

Didn't Arenas get injured, and wasn't he their main 3-point threat?

Yeah, after all, one guy who can hit a jumper is all you need.

This is apples to oranges IMO. It would be like taking an NFL all star team, and making them play canadian football vs the rest of the world, who only play canadian football.

Give the rest of the world 5 years to master Maximum Football, and they'll beat the hell out of our NFL players.

Arenas was dinged up in practice, and the coaches supposedly told him he was "on the bubble" anyways, so he went home. Nice coaches there :(

I'll third this.

I'm not all that surprised, because the NBA has gotten about as far from play that will win in the international arena as possible. When basketball in the rest of the world catches up to us, and becomes all about flash and physical play, then we'll have them right where we want them.

Fourthed. I would even have known this thing was going on if I didn't stop by ESPN.com every once in a while.

Not that I really care at all about this but, David Stern has ruined the American game. NBA players are not allowed to play defense and permitted to take a half-mile running start on their way to the basket, meaning that we have lots of kids who can dunk one-on-one and no one who can shoot, run plays, or defend. When that approach runs into a team that plays proper basketball (as the Pistons did before the NBA tweaked the rules yet again to limit defenders), proper basketball wins, just with fewer SportsCenter highlights.

Oh well...

So much for Lebron making his teammates better.

Did we have any members of the NBA's all defensive team on this team?

So much for Lebron making his teammates better.

Did we have any members of the NBA's all defensive team on this team?

Wow, I'm suprised it took you that long.

I just woke up, gimme a break. :)

Though, I havent watched a second or even a commerical about the WBC, so no worries. Sounds like the team was missing a killer instinct and a never die warrior (with talent) so hopefully the Olympics will prove much better

so hopefully the Olympics will prove much better

When are the next Olympics? I thought the big thing about this team is to keep them together for years...

2 years right?

Barring injury, I doubt this team will be the exact team that will play in 2008

There are 20 some players in the system right now for the US. A bunch of them were hurt this season, and could not participate. I would guess that next summers squad that has to play for the Olympics bid will be much better. And hopefully the next olympic squad will have guys like Kobe, Arenas, Billips and Michael Redd on it. Hell, I'm suprised someone like Tayshaun Prince wasn't on it, or Rip Hamilton as well.

I just woke up, gimme a break. :)

Though, I havent watched a second or even a commerical about the WBC, so no worries. Sounds like the team was missing a killer instinct and a never die warrior (with talent) so hopefully the Olympics will prove much better

Of course, the playoffs have shown that Kobe isn't that guy.

NBA All-Defense Teams:

First Team:
Ron Artest
Bruce Bowen
Kobe Bryant
Jason Kidd
Andrei Kirilenko
Ben Wallace

Second Team:
Chauncey Billups
Marcus Camby
Tim Duncan
Kevin Garnett
Tayshaun Prince

It's funny that they didn't fix any of the problems that they knew they had. They needed some defensive stoppers, then they cut Bruce Bowen. They need some shooters to bust open those European zones, and they don't have any. They know that the other teams all have bigs, yet all we can muster is Brad Miller and a bunch of power forwards disguised as centers.

This is how all of those Europeans must have felt when Lance Armstrong was winning all of "their" Tour de Frances.

Why are there 6 members of the First Team? Was there a tie?

Why are there 6 members of the First Team? Was there a tie?

6 players provide better defense than just 5.

Labor laws mandate that we include a foreign player

This is apples to oranges IMO. It would be like taking an NFL all star team, and making them play canadian football vs the rest of the world, who only play canadian football.

Nope. Not even close. You're simply making excuses for a U.S. team lacking in fundamentals. A more apt comparison is that if the football in the NFL evolved into everybody throwing 60-yard bombs on every play and then having an all-star team playing an international team that played under the same NFL rules but actually decided to run the ball as a big part of the offense. That's where U.S. basketball is right now. Simply stated, it's not the best basketball in the world. More entertaining, perhaps, and with the best raw skill, but not the best basketball.

I don't follow the NBA, I'll watch a Finals game here and there but usually only when one team has 3 wins, and I certainly don't follow the international basketball scene. So, keep in mind the following question is coming from someone with practically zero knowledge of the NBA.

If the USA is losing to these international teams with no, or very few NBA players, why doesn't a team in the NBA adopt a gameplan/strategy/philosophy that these international teams use to beat us? I know that the USA team doesn't have "the best of the best" of the NBA, but you have a team filled with NBA players that are atleast "well-known stars" losing to a team with no NBA players at all. You'd think an NBA team would run a system that these international teams run and make an easy run at the Championship. So why don't they? Are the international rules that different (I know even a few rules differences could make a world of difference)?

The rules of the game are different. The refs are different, and call things in different ways. There's no excuse for the US not being able to hit an open jumper. But international ball and us ball are 2 different animals.

World Baseball Championships.....check
World Hockey Championships.......check
World Basketball Championships.....check
World Soccer Championships AKA World Cup......check


Maybe we should just pull out of all international team sports competitions.:(

World Baseball Championships.....check
World Hockey Championships.......check
World Basketball Championships.....check
World Soccer Championships AKA World Cup......check


Maybe we should just pull out of all international team sports competitions.:(

The last one is just not in the same ball park as the other three. Football (NFL), baseball, basketball, hockey - America are one of the few countries that play. Football ('soccer') is a global game and the USA is a long way from being a major player.

It's like cricket - England are #2 in the world now we've beaten Pakistan, but in effect cricket is only really played seriously in 9-10 countries. We're ranked highly in snooker, darts and croquet - once you start looking at sports played by more than a few countries, the chances of winning diminish.

Don't fall into the trap of believing USA are genuinely a world football (soccer) power...

(PS - not railing against the USA, just stating fact that while basketball is one of the sports America should expect to win, football (soccer) is not)

Once again they go into an international competition without any 3 point marksmen. So the loss is not suprising at all. Perhaps next year they will find some guys that can hit 40% from the international distance.

But I think a healthy Marion and a healthy Amare might make a difference the next time.

you realize the international line is 2.5 feet closer.

A statistical defense of the USA basketball team:
PPG: 1
FG%: 2 (by 0.2%)
2-pt FG%: 3 (.2% behind first)
3-pt FG%: 9 (but of the final 4, we were 3rd, .2% behind Argentina and .1% behind Spain)
FT%: 11 (well behind the final 4, the one true measure of failure)
Reb (all per game): 3 (only Argentina ahead for final 4)
Blocks: 1 (tied)
Assists: 1
A/TO: 1
Steals: 1
S/TO: 1
TO/G: The least per game
F/G: 6 (tied with Greece)

So I'm not really sure where the whole, they have no fundamentals thing is coming from. They lack 1 key fundamental compared to the other teams: Free throw shooting. People seem to rail on them for not hitting threes (though they do), but most people don't really consider that a fundamental. They pass well, don't turn the ball over, hit their two point shots, rebound. Even if they hit their free throws at a 75% clip (the average of the top 10), that's 15 extra points, over 8 games. That's two a game.

I'm not necesarily defending the team, they just got beat by a team that isn't really much worse. Hell, England lost to Portugal in soccer, but surely people wouldn't say that the Premier League is worse than Portugal's league. The US threw up a bad game when they couldn't afford it (and being a Duke fan, it's not like I haven't seen that from a Coach K team before), and a good team made them pay.

But the idea that they lack fundamentals isn't really born out when you look at the stats.

I wish the NBA had the international lane they use.

So I'm not really sure where the whole, they have no fundamentals thing is coming from.

It's just the easy, lazy thing to say for someone who doesn't watch any basketball at the NBA or international level.

The last one is just not in the same ball park as the other three. Football (NFL), baseball, basketball, hockey - America are one of the few countries that play. Football ('soccer') is a global game and the USA is a long way from being a major player.

It's like cricket - England are #2 in the world now we've beaten Pakistan, but in effect cricket is only really played seriously in 9-10 countries. We're ranked highly in snooker, darts and croquet - once you start looking at sports played by more than a few countries, the chances of winning diminish.

Don't fall into the trap of believing USA are genuinely a world football (soccer) power...

(PS - not railing against the USA, just stating fact that while basketball is one of the sports America should expect to win, football (soccer) is not)

By no means am I trying to say the US is a soccer power. What I meant was that our record in international team sports competition has been less than stellar.

(PS - not railing against the USA, just stating fact that while basketball is one of the sports America should expect to win, football (soccer) is not)

In all honesty, I am wondering if we should EXPECT to win international competitions in basketball, baseball, and hockey.

This is how all of those Europeans must have felt when Lance Armstrong was winning all of "their" Tour de Frances.

You don't think they cared either?

you realize the international line is 2.5 feet closer.
Yes, that's the extra pathetic thing.

Technically, Team USA could consist of Puerto Ricans. Maybe then we would win some big games.

WOW, Spain is the new world champ after beating Greece (70-47). There was no game, Greece couldn't score at all, Spain was the only team playing even with Gasol not playing the game after he broke his foot in the semi-final. Great world championship by Paul Gasol brother, Marc, who is following his brother steps.

Spain has some NBA present/future players btw:

Pau Gasol (Starter in Memphis)
J.M. Calderon (Starter in Toronto)
Sergio Rodriguez (2006 1st round, #27 drafted by Phoenix and tradded to Portland)
Jorge Garbajosa (Just signed as undrafted FA by Toronto)

It's too bad the Europeans don't start their own professional league with teams in all the major European cities.

WOW, Spain is the new world champ after beating Greece (70-47). There was no game, Greece couldn't score at all, Spain was the only team playing even with Gasol not playing the game after he broke his foot in the semi-final. Great world championship by Paul Gasol brother, Marc, who is following his brother steps.

Spain has some NBA present/future players btw:

Pau Gasol (Starter in Memphis)
J.M. Calderon (Starter in Toronto)
Sergio Rodriguez (2006 1st round, #27 drafted by Phoenix and tradded to Portland)
Jorge Garbajosa (Just signed as undrafted FA by Toronto)
Gasol broke something in his foot, and will be out for 3-4 months. The Grizzlies now become the sleeper team in the Greg Oden lottery. Even when his foot is healed, his conditioning is going to be shit for a month or two, it's going to be a long season in memphis.

USA Takes Bronze

USA Takes Bronze

Thank you for the history lesson

Technically, Team USA could consist of Puerto Ricans. Maybe then we would win some big games.

That's the real reason we attacked Iraq. We are going to make them a US province so we can pillage their pool of NBA talent.

A statistical defense of the USA basketball team:
PPG: 1
FG%: 2 (by 0.2%)
2-pt FG%: 3 (.2% behind first)
3-pt FG%: 9 (but of the final 4, we were 3rd, .2% behind Argentina and .1% behind Spain)
FT%: 11 (well behind the final 4, the one true measure of failure)
Reb (all per game): 3 (only Argentina ahead for final 4)
Blocks: 1 (tied)
Assists: 1
A/TO: 1
Steals: 1
S/TO: 1
TO/G: The least per game
F/G: 6 (tied with Greece)

So I'm not really sure where the whole, they have no fundamentals thing is coming from. They lack 1 key fundamental compared to the other teams: Free throw shooting. People seem to rail on them for not hitting threes (though they do), but most people don't really consider that a fundamental. They pass well, don't turn the ball over, hit their two point shots, rebound. Even if they hit their free throws at a 75% clip (the average of the top 10), that's 15 extra points, over 8 games. That's two a game.

I'm not necesarily defending the team, they just got beat by a team that isn't really much worse. Hell, England lost to Portugal in soccer, but surely people wouldn't say that the Premier League is worse than Portugal's league. The US threw up a bad game when they couldn't afford it (and being a Duke fan, it's not like I haven't seen that from a Coach K team before), and a good team made them pay.

But the idea that they lack fundamentals isn't really born out when you look at the stats.

You can break it down with stats if you like, but I watched 3 Team USA games and that's exactly what they lacked. They can pass the ball, dribble, run the floor, etc, but they can't play half court offense, and they can't play defense. Those are the most crucial elements of team fundamentals.

Their passing and ball movement are ineffective and looked scripted and predictable. It reminds me of a half-court drill we used to run in practice where we had to make 4 passes and then shoot... that's how they play. They make a couple of unimpressive passes before one guy puts it up. There was no movement off the ball, no screens, no anything that resembled a well drilled team.

It's not coach K's fault - you watch his Duke teams play and it's obvious he knows a thing or two about basketball as soon as you see Redick running around those screens he threw at him - it's just that NBA basketball is so different from this FIBA game, and it's hard to get NBA superstars to assume regular roles on a team when they've never in their entire playing days played a role like that.

So did the US win the bronze medal game? Or did Argentina lose it?

World Baseball Championships.....check
World Hockey Championships.......check
World Basketball Championships.....check
World Soccer Championships AKA World Cup......check


Maybe we should just pull out of all international team sports competitions.:(

Adding the Women's World Basketball Championships, Ryder Cup, and the Davis Cup to the list