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View Full Version : PING: Cubs Fans .. you owe someone an apology!


DeToxRox
04-01-2008, 10:10 PM
Should Steve Bartman be off the hook with Cubs fans? According to Moises Alou, he should be.

Bartman ball

The threadbare remains of the baseball deflected by Steve Bartman in the Cubs' Game 6 loss to the Marlins rest inside a case moments after being blown up in Chicago.

Alou, now with the Mets, said he wouldn't have caught the now-infamous pop foul in the 2003 National League Championship Series that hit the heel of Bartman's hand in the eighth inning of Game 6, prolonging an inning in which the Marlins later rallied for the lead. Florida went on to win the series.

The Cubs were leading the Marlins three games to two in the 2003 NLCS, ahead 3-0 in the top of the eighth inning and five outs from returning to the World Series for the first time since 1945 when Florida's Luis Castillo lifted a foul down the line in left just past the bullpen.

Alou raced over, timed his jump perfectly, opened his glove wide -- and got beat to the ball by a 26-year-old youth baseball coach in Row 116, Seat 9 who didn't do anything more strenuous than stand up. The baseball hit the heel of Bartman's hand and caromed farther back into the stands. In the Marlins dugout, Game 7 pitcher Mark Redman turned to a teammate and said, "Let's make this kid famous."

They did, but only because a few pitches later, Cubs shortstop Alex Gonzalez made an equally ham-handed attempt on a grounder that should have been an inning-ending double play. Florida erupted for eight runs to win Game 6 and the only real suspense left was whether the kid would get out of Wrigley Field alive that night. The Marlins clinched the NLCS the night after.

"Everywhere I play, even now, people still yell, 'Bartman! Bartman!' I feel really bad for the kid," Alou told Associated Press columnist Jim Litke.

"You know what the funny thing is?" he added a moment later. "I wouldn't have caught it, anyway."

That stands in stark contrast to Alou's reaction at the time. After the play, he jumped up and down with his arms outstretched.

After the game, he said: "I timed it perfectly, I jumped perfectly. I'm almost 100 percent that I had a clean shot to catch the ball. All of a sudden, there's a hand on my glove."

He didn't have kind words for Bartman on that night either.

"Hopefully, he won't have to regret it for the rest of his life," he said.

Bartman is fine and still in hiding somewhere in the Chicago area. The baseball didn't fare quite as well.

Lifelong Cubs fan Grant DePorter, who doubles as president of Harry Caray's Restaurant Group, the popular chain named after the famous broadcaster, paid $113,824.16 for the ball at an auction that December and turned it into a multimillion-dollar publicity stunt. First, he arranged for it to visit Wrigley Field one last time, then set the baseball up in a hotel suite for a last supper of steak, lobster and ice-cold Bud. The day after that, on live TV, it was blown to smithereens.

"It sounds insane now, all that money for a baseball we were going to blow up," DePorter said, standing behind the desk in his office. "But I remember exactly what I was thinking back then."

ISiddiqui
04-01-2008, 10:12 PM
I think Alou just feels bad for the guy and is trying to be nice.

DeToxRox
04-01-2008, 10:13 PM
I think Alou just feels bad for the guy and is trying to be nice.

I've said all along he wouldn't have caught it. It isn't as if Alou was exactly Mr. Gold Glove back then.

LloydLungs
04-01-2008, 10:21 PM
He might have, he might not have. As a home fan you have to be savvy enough to get the eff out of the way and give your fielder a chance. Bartman didn't lose that game, but I still declare him an idiot.

Maple Leafs
04-01-2008, 10:33 PM
Alex Gonzalez should get down on his knees and thank the lord for Steve Bartman every day.

Atocep
04-01-2008, 10:36 PM
On the bright side, it saved the Cubs from still having Dusty as their manager.

Radii
04-01-2008, 10:47 PM
I think Alou just feels bad for the guy and is trying to be nice.

I think this is true, but i also think making Bartman a scapegoat is moronic. Gonzalez, leaving prior in, blah blah blah.

Ksyrup
04-02-2008, 06:46 AM
He should feel bad. He and Dusty essentially blamed the loss on the guy after the game.

larrymcg421
04-02-2008, 07:43 AM
What I never understood about the situation is that Bartman wasn't the only fan who went for the ball. How come the others didn't get criticized?

It's like if a group of 10 people all threw very heavy objects at Dusty Baker. If only one of them hit Dusty, does that mean the other 9 shouldn't also be condemned for their actions?

I suppose some will argue that none of them should be condemned, but that's outside the point of the analogy.

Ksyrup
04-02-2008, 07:49 AM
Dusty would just complain that all those heavy objects were "clogging his view of the guys clogging up the bases."

sterlingice
04-02-2008, 08:02 AM
It's like if a group of 10 people all threw very heavy objects at Dusty Baker. If only one of them hit Dusty, does that mean the other 9 shouldn't also be condemned for their actions?

If by "condemned", you mean "rewarded", provided it made him incapable of managing the rest of the game, thus allowing the pitcher, who was on his 147th pitch, to finally escape ;)

SI

Barkeep49
04-02-2008, 08:22 AM
The problem was always Alex Gonzalez's mishandling of the ball more than Bartman. However, Bartman created some bad vibes that led to Gonzalez being rattled, imho.

Toddzilla
04-02-2008, 08:28 AM
Wilbon is right - Alou doesn't wear a Cubs uniform anymore, so he doesn't have the right to take Bartman off the hook. Those of us still emotionally invested in the team are the sole arbiters.

That being said, I never blamed him, so feh.

Lathum
04-02-2008, 08:49 AM
If Alou didn't reaact the way he did at the time it would be no big deal.

Ksyrup
04-02-2008, 12:35 PM
Cubs also owe Ernie Banks an apology. They have to re-do the statute they just unveiled of him because the apostrophe is missing from "Let's Play Two."

Ksyrup
04-02-2008, 12:38 PM
If Alou didn't reaact the way he did at the time it would be no big deal.

Don't forget Dusty stoking the flames:

DUSTY BAKER: "Nah, it has nothing to do with the curse, it has to with, you know, like I said, that fan interference. No, history had nothing to do with this game, nothing."

Butter
04-02-2008, 12:38 PM
Cubs also owe Ernie Banks an apology. They have to re-do the statute they just unveiled of him because the apostrophe is missing from "Let's Play Two."

That's right, it's a sculpture of limitations.

Ksyrup
04-02-2008, 12:46 PM
Hey, I'm in the middle of reviewing some South Carolina statutes right now. Give a man a break!

hoopsguy
04-02-2008, 12:58 PM
This Cubs fan isn't inclined to apologize to Bartman. I was furious at the time and still get annoyed when I think of the play.

As others have stated, there were a long list of other issues that kept the Cubs from winning that series. And I am happy that Bartman has never tried to capitalize on his 15 minutes of "fame". But neither of these points changes the emotional response that I have when this guy's name comes up in conversation. And I don't think there is anything that Moises Alou can say or do at this point to change my mind on this point.

Is this a stupid, emotional response? Yep.

Toddzilla
04-02-2008, 02:40 PM
This Cubs fan isn't inclined to apologize to Bartman. I was furious at the time and still get annoyed when I think of the play.

...

Is this the correct response? Yep.fixed.

Passacaglia
04-02-2008, 02:57 PM
This Cubs fan isn't inclined to apologize to Bartman. I was furious at the time and still get annoyed when I think of the play.

As others have stated, there were a long list of other issues that kept the Cubs from winning that series. And I am happy that Bartman has never tried to capitalize on his 15 minutes of "fame". But neither of these points changes the emotional response that I have when this guy's name comes up in conversation. And I don't think there is anything that Moises Alou can say or do at this point to change my mind on this point.

Is this a stupid, emotional response? Yep.

He could threaten to pee on your hands. That might change your mind.

hoopsguy
04-02-2008, 04:18 PM
He could threaten to pee on your hands. That might change your mind.

I thought about making a gratuitious "pee on hands" remark when Alou came up but decided to focus on Bartman instead. Seriously, I have no idea how someone comes up with the idea of that helping his stroke (pun not initially intended but left now that I typed it). Nor can I fathom why he would share this with reporters if it was something that worked for him.